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Ask HN: Is Python dying?

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Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#231

Post by jkestner »

windlep wrote: post #215

Yes, Python is dying, that's why it just moved up in the Tiobe rankings to #5, displacing PHP (which obviously no one ever uses): http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.... It's dominance of science is why Python has 25% science talks this year at PyCon, and why we see articles like: http://www.infoworld.com/article/3012442/application-develop... But yes, if you didn't know any languages, then of…

Python is dying the same way Apple is dying. Only to people addicted to the new and the exciting.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#232

Post by coldtea »

scrollaway wrote: post #172
ekimekim wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4. Some people have made an informed decision and prefer python 2 over python 3, even without considering dependencies/migration cost. (cue the downvotes)

If you get downvoted for that it's because Python 3 is objectively better than 2 in every way other than the points I listed above... Seriously. List one feature Python 2 has that Python 3 doesn't?

Massive compatibility with the biggest installed Python codebases?

People already know it?

The most used?

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#233

Post by ForHackernews »

switchbak wrote: post #156
Alex3917 wrote: post #16

Not only is Python not dying, but it's stronger than it's ever been. The majority of top colleges are now teaching CS using Python. It's completely dominant in academia, finance, and startups. It has the best libraries and documentation of any language. And Django has arguably the strongest community of any open source project period. That's not to say there are zero problems, but Python is so much better than all th…

I wouldn't say Python is dominant in startups across the board. Though it is strong in data-heavy environments (with all it's issues nonetheless). I've been a Pythonista for over a decade, and the API scene isn't quite as utopian as you describe. Date/time handling in particular is a really poorly handled area, but there's quite a few out there. That said, in general I agree the 'batteries included' approach is good,…

> Date/time handling in particular is a really poorly handled area

Just use Arrow http://crsmithdev.com/arrow/ everywhere, all the time(s). Now your date/time problems are solved.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#234

Post by huuu »

viraptor wrote: post #5

That may be a view through the distorted HN lenses. Spend some time on Lambda the Ultimate and you'll think imperative programming is dying. Go is new and has lots of issues. It's annoying on many fronts and badly needs improvements in packaging area. It's good for some things and worse for others. JS is for frontend, because it's the only supported language. (although there are python-to-js compilers available if yo…

Take off the HN glasses and PHP, Java, C# and loads of other 'old' languages are still huge.

As for Python: I think it is starting to grow again in the Linux world.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#235

Post by karangoeluw »

windlep wrote: post #215

Yes, Python is dying, that's why it just moved up in the Tiobe rankings to #5, displacing PHP (which obviously no one ever uses): http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.... It's dominance of science is why Python has 25% science talks this year at PyCon, and why we see articles like: http://www.infoworld.com/article/3012442/application-develop... But yes, if you didn't know any languages, then of…

> displacing PHP (which obviously no one ever uses

21% of the Internet uses Wordpress, which is built with PHP.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#236

Post by awwaiid »

pyre wrote: post #186
karavelov wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can't be said - Perl6 is completely different language and brings a lot of desireable features on the table. The problem is that it is not so easy to port Perl5 code to Perl6 as porting Python from 2 and 3.

> The problem is that it is not so easy to port Perl5 code to Perl6 as porting Python from 2 and 3. Is this really the case? https://github.com/niner/Inline-Perl5 http://stackoverflow.com/questions/9173043/how-can-i-use-per...

Yes this is the case; Through libraries we are trying to make it easy to CALL perl5 (and ruby and python and...) modules from Perl 6. But porting -- aka translating -- is another matter. Mostly it requires a similar amount of effort as if you are translating your program to any other dynamic language for nontrivial programs.

My understanding is that LOTS of Python2 programs work fine in Python3 with no (or very trivial) changes. Very very few Perl5 programs will work fine in Perl6 with no changes.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#237

Post by x0x0 »

imron wrote: post #227
TylerE wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anything that breaks code AGAIN will kill the language for sure.

Not sure why you're getting downvotes. The 2 vs 3 has already split part of Python's userbase. Another change that broke significant amounts of code would just make things even worse.

I'm not sure that's true.

My objection to 3 was it did nothing for me. All I got out of it was work dumped in my lap just so my code would continue running.

Giving us a GIL-less pypy with jvm-scale performance would be worth a lot of hassle.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#238

Post by craigds »

joslin01 wrote: post #122
hoodoof wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your snark was somewhat incoherent. Can you be more clear? guessing from the cpan in your name you're a Perl person?

It was coherent and I would not define it as snark. You don't comprehend his point yet you have the wherewithal to label it as incoherent & snarky -- that's snarky. But I digress.. Python users had a choice to stay in 2.7 land or make changes to their codebase for not much in return. Many chose to stay in 2.7 land, which you could safely say is stagnant. As a result, if you can't keep moving with Python, where will y…

> if you can't keep moving with Python, where will you go?

I think it's too soon to tell about the python 2 to 3 switch. I see people on here all the time making remarks about how many years its been and people still aren't on Python 3, but honestly, it's a big change and it takes a while to upgrade.

Python 2 is still supported (till 2020) and that's the line in the sand for a lot of companies. Many companies will have this in their roadmaps, but don't see a need to prioritise upgrading over other business priorities just yet.

I work at a small company for which this is the case. We absolutely will upgrade to Python 3 (before 2020), and can't wait to do so - there's loads of cool stuff in Python 3! But with a large codebase written in 2.7, this is not something we can just do in a weekend sprint. It will take several months of development and careful testing of our many dependencies. I'm sure many companies are in the same boat.

This clearly doesn't mean Python is dying. Both versions of python are still supported, and many, many people are actively using them and producing quality software. It's a great ecosystem to be part of :)

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#239

Post by awwaiid »

Gratsby wrote: post #129
21 wrote: post #19

Interesting stats regarding version 2/3 usage from a moderator of /r/python today: Here's the breakdown by which Pythons were used to download from PyPI in the last two weeks: 2.7 85.90% 2.6 6.66% 3.4 4.64% 3.5 2.09% 3.3 0.56% 3.2 0.12% (Two weeks was ~133 million downloads) https://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/45sm94/what_are_the...

To be fair, Python 2.x is installed everywhere and python 3.x wasn't really usable in production until 3.3. And there's barriers to migration like Twisted has. It's been a lot of years, but people are slowly and finally starting to migrate to 3. It could be worse. I'm still waiting for perl6 because those guys got caught up in Haskell hell.

Er... wait no longer! Grab rakudobrew and perl6 some stuff :)

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#240

Post by X-Istence »

startling wrote: post #200
make3 wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... python 3 is a really a fairly small effort to learn when you know python 2. You'll learn most of what you need to know in a few days, tops. This comment feels extremely disingenuous

You don't invest time to learn it, you invest time by writing or converting code.

Writing code for Python 3 and 2 isn't that difficult.

I've been doing it for a while now while working on a variety of different libraries for the Pyramid project, as well as hacking on WebOb which is Python 2 and 3.

Especially if you drop Python 3.2 and lower from the Py 3.x series you have very little trouble writing code that runs on both (with a shim or two here and there).

It's not nearly as difficult as it once was.

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