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Ask HN: Is Python dying?

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Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#171

Post by BuckRogers »

scrollaway wrote: post #90
shadowmint wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Be aware that PyPI isn't a great way to get accurate statistics. You can't just ignore a bunch of statistics because they aren't convenient to you; that's not how maths works. Statistical sampling is based on the premise that your sample is randomized from the total population; I would argue that the stats from pypi represent a reasonable random sample of python users around the world. Certainly, you can argue otherw…

GP has argued otherwise. PyPI sampling is not random. It is heavily influenced by automatic downloads and such and completely ignores that most simple 2.x libs / non-3.3-tagged libs will work just fine on python 3. In other words, it is neither random nor representative of python 3 usage, failing the premise you yourself mentioned. There's no easy way to determine Python 3 usage overall. Your best bet is to go around…

>So maybe CloudShareBuzzr Inc. is using Python 2.7 internally, but they don't produce anything open source so it doesn't affect the rest of the ecosystem.

It does matter because that means if you ever want to do it as a job, you HAVE to learn Python2 for that gig at CloudShareBuzzr. Paying your bills is always going to top using "the latest version" of anything. I'm not sure why people ignore or miss that point.

Python3 is the optional language, 2 is mandatory if you want to get paid.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#172

Post by scrollaway »

ekimekim wrote: post #158
scrollaway wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GP has argued otherwise. PyPI sampling is not random. It is heavily influenced by automatic downloads and such and completely ignores that most simple 2.x libs / non-3.3-tagged libs will work just fine on python 3. In other words, it is neither random nor representative of python 3 usage, failing the premise you yourself mentioned. There's no easy way to determine Python 3 usage overall. Your best bet is to go around…

4. Some people have made an informed decision and prefer python 2 over python 3, even without considering dependencies/migration cost. (cue the downvotes)

If you get downvoted for that it's because Python 3 is objectively better than 2 in every way other than the points I listed above...

Seriously. List one feature Python 2 has that Python 3 doesn't?

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#173

Post by benatkin »

21 wrote: post #19

Interesting stats regarding version 2/3 usage from a moderator of /r/python today: Here's the breakdown by which Pythons were used to download from PyPI in the last two weeks: 2.7 85.90% 2.6 6.66% 3.4 4.64% 3.5 2.09% 3.3 0.56% 3.2 0.12% (Two weeks was ~133 million downloads) https://www.reddit.com/r/Python/comments/45sm94/what_are_the...

I'm disinclined to use it, partly because it shows a community that's slow to evolve, but mostly because the Python project decided that 2.7 was the last 2.x.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#174

Post by tayo42 »

kedean wrote: post #166
spiralpolitik wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Next year has always been the year that functional programming will take over the world. It's been like that since I started programming in the early 90s. While functional concepts have leaked into imperative languages, Haskell is the only pure functional language that so far has come close to breaking out although Lisp has also gotten close a few times. (see also next year will be the year of Linux on Desktop)

Clojure and Scala have gotten close as well. I've seen Scala in use at scale at both universities and corporations. Clojure is being used in production by at least a few well known companies, too. Both have the primary benefit of being backed by the JVM.

Scala seems to have some momentum. I've wondered if the companies that have adopted it are using it like jvm haskell or a just a better java?

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#176

Post by make3 »

zzzcpan wrote: post #102
hoodoof wrote: post #36

http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=python Showing 1-10 of 169,970 Python jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=ruby Showing 1-10 of 128,305 Ruby jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=java Showing 1-10 of 190,126 Java jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=golang Showing 1-10 of 219 Golang jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=julia Showing 1-10 of 206 Julia jobs http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=%22pyth…

http://www.simplyhired.com/search?q=perl Showing 1-10 of 220,528 Perl jobs And you know, Perl is dead. Basically, Python gave a choice to a lot of people to either invest time into 3.x without any important improvements or to keep using 2.7 and invest time playing with other languages. Which in turn accelerated Python's decline and raised questions about it dying, promoting the idea even more. But there is no need to…

... python 3 is a really a fairly small effort to learn when you know python 2. You'll learn most of what you need to know in a few days, tops. This comment feels extremely disingenuous

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#177

Post by cyphar »

switchbak wrote: post #156
Alex3917 wrote: post #16

Not only is Python not dying, but it's stronger than it's ever been. The majority of top colleges are now teaching CS using Python. It's completely dominant in academia, finance, and startups. It has the best libraries and documentation of any language. And Django has arguably the strongest community of any open source project period. That's not to say there are zero problems, but Python is so much better than all th…

I wouldn't say Python is dominant in startups across the board. Though it is strong in data-heavy environments (with all it's issues nonetheless). I've been a Pythonista for over a decade, and the API scene isn't quite as utopian as you describe. Date/time handling in particular is a really poorly handled area, but there's quite a few out there. That said, in general I agree the 'batteries included' approach is good,…

> Though it is strong in data-heavy environments (with all it's issues nonetheless).

Which is why numpy and scipy are so full-featured and pretty damn fast.

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#178

Post by eru »

spiralpolitik wrote: post #88
viraptor wrote: post #5

That may be a view through the distorted HN lenses. Spend some time on Lambda the Ultimate and you'll think imperative programming is dying. Go is new and has lots of issues. It's annoying on many fronts and badly needs improvements in packaging area. It's good for some things and worse for others. JS is for frontend, because it's the only supported language. (although there are python-to-js compilers available if yo…

Next year has always been the year that functional programming will take over the world. It's been like that since I started programming in the early 90s. While functional concepts have leaked into imperative languages, Haskell is the only pure functional language that so far has come close to breaking out although Lisp has also gotten close a few times. (see also next year will be the year of Linux on Desktop)

> While functional concepts have leaked into imperative languages, [...]

I predict we'll see more and more of that, but never a great breakthrough:

- appreciation of pure functions and immutability - optional typing even in Python - Garbage collection (mainstream since Java) - higher order functions - algebraic data types (in Scala, sort-of possible in C++ boost, and even in protobuf) - etc

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#179

Post by [deleted] »

joslin01 wrote: post #122
hoodoof wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your snark was somewhat incoherent. Can you be more clear? guessing from the cpan in your name you're a Perl person?

It was coherent and I would not define it as snark. You don't comprehend his point yet you have the wherewithal to label it as incoherent & snarky -- that's snarky. But I digress.. Python users had a choice to stay in 2.7 land or make changes to their codebase for not much in return. Many chose to stay in 2.7 land, which you could safely say is stagnant. As a result, if you can't keep moving with Python, where will y…

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Is Python dying?

#180

Post by ryan-allen »

I don't think so, it seems to be the go-to language for scientific stats work, maybe for web development it is trending down though?

Udacity's stats courses use R and Python, a friend of mine who works in environmental research, it is all they use! Google still use it heavily as far as I know?

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