Live data from Hacker News

Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

tutanota.com

31–40 of 44 posts

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#31

"In Germany there is no law that could force us to submit to a gag order or to implement a backdoor." meanwhile "Cock.li e-mail server seized by German authorities, admin announces" http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/12/cock-li-e-mail-se... -edit- to: all yes I realize seizure is not a gag order nor a backdoor. but the whole article spends thousand word praising how privacy is so much more safe in Germany and ho…

And, well, laws can be changed anyway.

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#32
I would not bet on German data privacy laws. Historically Germany was ok in that regard (not exceptional but I'd say squarely in the "one of the better places to keep your data" camp). However "Vorratsdatenspeicherung" was recently voted into action so ISPs have to keep personal information of their customers on file just in case some agency might need them. The law passed relatively smoothly and that's pretty much all you need to know about the general trend (less privacy, more state power).

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#33
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

See https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10774152 for details and analysis.

>Cock.li was reportedly used last week to send a bogus bomb threat e-mail from "madbomber@cock.li" to several school districts nationwide, which led to the closure of all schools in the Los Angeles Unified School District. I don't see what that has to do with dick-jokes being the reason

Concern over privacy, which has been severely compromised by the confiscation of ~65k users' data (including stored email) in an investigation into the actions of one, seems not particularly on offer in this case, where the only significant departure from the norm is that the service is named after a shameless dick joke.

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>(just buy them at any shop/gas station, no info/ID required By law, they have to request your name, adress and DOB before you can activate the card (usually not done in store, but online at home). They don't need to validate them though (no ID required) and it's not illegal to make false statements :).

Huh, they didn't ask me for anything, I just bought the card and it worked as soon as I inserted it into the phone...

The shop might've activated the card with their details for you. There are also a lot of preactivated cards for sale on ebay. But some details were given to the provider, just not yours.

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#35
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.alditalk.de/surfen/ Aldi Talk. Coverage is good, speed is okay. 4G is supported in the main cities. Delivery is only possible within Germany, but you can grab the SIM card at any Aldi for 12.99€ including 10€ credit. Top up with a 5€ voucher brought at Aldi (ask at the register).

Last time I used them, I had to register it. I did through phone with a fake address but they disabled the card some weeks later...

Most providers activate the cards and send out a welcome letter via snail mail. If it bounces, the card get's deactivated. Doubt there are any providers who allow fake details forever.

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#36
> In Germany there is no law that could force us to submit to a gag order or to implement a backdoor.

Meanwhile, Germany's largest ISP (Deutsche Telekom) is handing over all data of its daughter companies in neighboring countries (in many of which Deutsche Telekom is in a monopoly position - handling most of the Internet traffic) to Germany's intelligence agencies and has supposedly been doing so for about a decade already.

Germany is doing a lot of the things its politicians have criticized the US for.

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#37
post #6

Aaah, Germany - the leader of privacy across the globe, the country where you're legally required to give up all your personal information in order to call someone from a prepaid phone card you just bought for 5 euro. And where you're not allowed to open up your wifi hotspot because someone might download an mp3 with it.

> give up all your personal information in order to call someone from a prepaid phone card you just bought for 5 euro. That is flat out untrue. I actually was surprised how easy it was to get prepaid SIM cards (just buy them at any shop/gas station, no info/ID required), load and use them however and whenever I want (also 15 Euros for 5GB 3G and works in USB data sticks, pretty nice). Illegal to have open Wifi, that…

> Illegal to have open Wifi, that is true :-) (I think it's a 125 Euro fine)

No, it is not illegal per se to have an open Wifi, but there is the dreaded paragraph of "Mitstörerhaftung" - that means in lots of cases if someone does something illegal over your open Wifi (say copyright violation), the person who runs the open Wifi will be liable for it.

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#39
post #37
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> give up all your personal information in order to call someone from a prepaid phone card you just bought for 5 euro. That is flat out untrue. I actually was surprised how easy it was to get prepaid SIM cards (just buy them at any shop/gas station, no info/ID required), load and use them however and whenever I want (also 15 Euros for 5GB 3G and works in USB data sticks, pretty nice). Illegal to have open Wifi, that…

> Illegal to have open Wifi, that is true :-) (I think it's a 125 Euro fine) No, it is not illegal per se to have an open Wifi, but there is the dreaded paragraph of "Mitstörerhaftung" - that means in lots of cases if someone does something illegal over your open Wifi (say copyright violation), the person who runs the open Wifi will be liable for it.

Störerhaftung (§1004 BGB) does not make you liable; it only means that you can be sued for injunctive relief [1]. Of course, under Germany's "loser pays" rules this means that you can be responsible for the cost of the proceedings. More importantly, in certain situation courts may consider the fact that a tort was committed using your IP as prima facie evidence that you were responsible (this is rebuttable, but can be difficult to prove).

But in general, yes, it's purely a matter of civil law.

[1] http://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_bgb/englisch_bgb....

Re: Data Privacy Protection: Why Tutanota Is in Germany

#40
post #25

"In Germany there is no law that could force us to submit to a gag order or to implement a backdoor." meanwhile "Cock.li e-mail server seized by German authorities, admin announces" http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2015/12/cock-li-e-mail-se... -edit- to: all yes I realize seizure is not a gag order nor a backdoor. but the whole article spends thousand word praising how privacy is so much more safe in Germany and ho…

Seizure can be made public and email server provider take actions to protect against seizure. This is how it should work. Ability to force gag order or implement a backdoor is really disgrace in democratic society.

>email server provider take actions to protect against seizure

And how might that be done. The obvious answer would be encrypt the hard drive but what's preventing law enforcement from doing a cold boot attack?

Post reply on HN