Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 124 posts

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#51

Post by cbeach »

cup wrote: post #48
cbeach wrote: post #34

Studies show that immigration, sadly, is linked to the spread of antibiotic-resistant diseases. Example: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/25418572/ Immigrant hotspots in London now have tuberculosis rates higher than Iraq and Rwanda. 80% of cases are people born abroad, and some are antibiotic-resistant. This is a disease we thought we'd erradicated: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-34637968 The U.K. h…

Bringing up immigration in a conversation about antibiotic resistance, knowing what we know about animal farming practices is ridiculous. An analogy is like complaining about one leaking faucet in a conversation about drought when everyone is watering their garden.

I see you didn't read even the abstract of the study I posted, then?

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#52

Post by maxerickson »

TelmoMenezes wrote: post #11
mschuster91 wrote: post #5

How about the most obvious solution: Stop keeping (farm) animals in conditions that require mass antibiotic feedings for the animals to survive?!

We are going in the opposite direction. Currently the US has more lax regulations than the EU. In the EU animals have to be healthy all the way throughout their lives to be sold as food. In the US, you can keep them in miserable conditions and then pump them full of antibiotics before slaughtering. Politicians are attempting to remove EU regulations against this under the guise of "removal of barriers to trade" with…

The US requires a withdrawal period before slaughter:

http://www.fsis.usda.gov/wps/portal/fsis/topics/food-safety-...

Select "Can hormones and antibiotics be used in cattle raising?".

I don't think In the US, you can keep them in miserable conditions and then pump them full of antibiotics before slaughtering. reasonably captures that.

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#53

Post by rnovak »

robotresearcher wrote: post #46
robotkilla wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm actually tired of the "blame the general public" argument. Blame the agricultural industry for this. I'm not going to take the blame for deforestation or lack of fresh water every time I eat a cheesburger, nor am I going to assume blame for pollution when I drive my car. Unless billions of people change within the next few years (which is so unrealistic that I feel comfortable saying it won't happen) then my indi…

final edit: I withdraw the comment below since the analogy is too inflammatory and I certainly don't intend to accuse the parent poster of racism. That's not cool or helpful. I'll leave it up so the replies make sense. How about this quote from Ghandi instead: “If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards…

Please explain how a direct action (racism/sexism/discrimination) is even somewhat close to the indirection required for "eating a cheesburger => deforestation"?

As Bill Engval says: Evel Knievel couldn't have made that jump.

How about focus on your own ethics instead of SHAMING people for eating for christ's sake.

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#54

Post by robotkilla »

robotresearcher wrote: post #46
robotkilla wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm actually tired of the "blame the general public" argument. Blame the agricultural industry for this. I'm not going to take the blame for deforestation or lack of fresh water every time I eat a cheesburger, nor am I going to assume blame for pollution when I drive my car. Unless billions of people change within the next few years (which is so unrealistic that I feel comfortable saying it won't happen) then my indi…

final edit: I withdraw the comment below since the analogy is too inflammatory and I certainly don't intend to accuse the parent poster of racism. That's not cool or helpful. I'll leave it up so the replies make sense. How about this quote from Ghandi instead: “If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards…

I'd like to preface this response by making it clear that I personally avoid eating animals that were raised on antibiotics, however the argument that the onus must be placed on the individual is absolutely ridiculous.

Even though this is a "hot button topic", I don't think eating meat that you can afford (IE antibiotic raised meat) can possibly be compared to race or gender inequalities.

Eating a factory cheeseburger is akin to racism? Seriously? This is a logic fallacy.

Racism comes from the individual. It stems from stupidity and hatred and is directed against people who don't have the same nationality or skin color as you. Eating an antibiotic laden slab of beef due to lack of finances cannot possibly be placed on the same level as this.

I'll also point out that the only way to real change in gender and race inequalities have come about is through government or self-regulation in industries... the same thing I'm arguing for when it comes to the agricultural industry.

Go ahead and switch to all natural blah blah blah... you can now sleep at night knowing you're no longer part of the problem. But when you wake up in the morning, the problem is still there. You have accomplished nothing. But hey, when the world burns at least you can say "I told you so".

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#55

Post by OldSchoolJohnny »

robotresearcher wrote: post #46
robotkilla wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm actually tired of the "blame the general public" argument. Blame the agricultural industry for this. I'm not going to take the blame for deforestation or lack of fresh water every time I eat a cheesburger, nor am I going to assume blame for pollution when I drive my car. Unless billions of people change within the next few years (which is so unrealistic that I feel comfortable saying it won't happen) then my indi…

final edit: I withdraw the comment below since the analogy is too inflammatory and I certainly don't intend to accuse the parent poster of racism. That's not cool or helpful. I'll leave it up so the replies make sense. How about this quote from Ghandi instead: “If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards…

Ridiculous

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#56

Post by marshray »

Betelgeuse90 wrote: post #9
mschuster91 wrote: post #5

How about the most obvious solution: Stop keeping (farm) animals in conditions that require mass antibiotic feedings for the animals to survive?!

Amen. Animal agriculture (innocuously referred to as "agriculture" in the article) has to be the single biggest contributor to the existence of these superbugs.

Not to mention all the killer diseases that made the jump from animal to man.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoonosis "Most human diseases originated in animals"

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#57

Post by invaliddata »

perlpimp wrote: post #42

"Alliance to Save Our Antibiotics says 837kg of colistin was sold to British farms in 2014." Why is this being sold to farmers in the first place, the antibiotic of last resistance?

Agricultural use of colistin worldwide, and especially in China, dwarfs this:

http://www.lancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(...

(see cached version for the full text, standard link has full text behind paywall)

... China is the world's largest poultry and pig producer, and in 2014 produced 17·5 million tonnes and 56·7 million tonnes, respectively.25 Most of the production is for domestic consumption with about 10% for export.26 The global market value of veterinary drugs increased from US$8·7 billion in 1992 to $20·1 billion in 2010, and in 2018 is anticipated to reach $43 billion.27, 28, 29 China is also one of the world's highest users of colistin in agriculture.29 Driven largely by China, the global demand for colistin in agriculture is expected to reach 11 942 tonnes per annum by the end of 2015 (with associated revenues of $229·5 million), rising to 16 500 tonnes by the year 2021, at an average annual growth rate of 4·75%.29 Of the top ten largest producers of colistin for veterinary use, one is Indian, one is Danish, and eight are Chinese. Asia (including China) makes up 73·1% of colistin production with 28·7% for export including to Europe.29 In 2015, the European Union and North America imported 480 tonnes and 700 tonnes, respectively, of colistin from China.29

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#58

Post by function_seven »

cbeach wrote: post #50
cbeach wrote: post #34

Studies show that immigration, sadly, is linked to the spread of antibiotic-resistant diseases. Example: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/25418572/ Immigrant hotspots in London now have tuberculosis rates higher than Iraq and Rwanda. 80% of cases are people born abroad, and some are antibiotic-resistant. This is a disease we thought we'd erradicated: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-34637968 The U.K. h…

The post went from 1, 2, then 3 votes, down to 1, zero and then -1. Interesting. I thought Hacker News might be the kind of forum where an argument backed with facts and sources (including peer reviewed papers) might be enough to break through tribal leftwing suppression of politically incorrect opinions. Evidently not.

A lot of readers reflexively downvote comments that have lines such as:

> I know how alarmist this comment sounds, and I fully expect it to be downvoted because it contradicts the politically-correct utopian vision of immigration that we're all expected to hold.

(Emphasis mine)

From the HN Guidelines[1]:

> Please don't bait other users by inviting them to downvote you or declare that you'll probably get downvoted.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#59

Post by vanilla-almond »

TelmoMenezes wrote: post #11
mschuster91 wrote: post #5

How about the most obvious solution: Stop keeping (farm) animals in conditions that require mass antibiotic feedings for the animals to survive?!

We are going in the opposite direction. Currently the US has more lax regulations than the EU. In the EU animals have to be healthy all the way throughout their lives to be sold as food. In the US, you can keep them in miserable conditions and then pump them full of antibiotics before slaughtering. Politicians are attempting to remove EU regulations against this under the guise of "removal of barriers to trade" with…

"In the US, you can keep them in miserable conditions and then pump them full of antibiotics before slaughtering."

How do you explain this then? (posted below by legulere)

http://i.imgur.com/9ybmhwE.jpg

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#60

Post by robotresearcher »

rnovak wrote: post #53
robotresearcher wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

final edit: I withdraw the comment below since the analogy is too inflammatory and I certainly don't intend to accuse the parent poster of racism. That's not cool or helpful. I'll leave it up so the replies make sense. How about this quote from Ghandi instead: “If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards…

Please explain how a direct action (racism/sexism/discrimination) is even somewhat close to the indirection required for "eating a cheesburger => deforestation"? As Bill Engval says: Evel Knievel couldn't have made that jump. How about focus on your own ethics instead of SHAMING people for eating for christ's sake.

I edited to explain. If you don't like something, stop doing it. Don't wait for someone to stop you doing it. Stick up for yourself.
Post reply on HN