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Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

bbc.com

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Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#31

Post by invaliddata »

davidw wrote: post #16
mschuster91 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the current problematic situation of animals is relatively well contained to the Western sphere (US, EU, maybe China). The Chinese already recognize the effects on nature, the EU too (and iirc they're already beginning to introduce measures), the biggest problem is and always will be the US because of the huge influence of the farming lobby on US politics (and even if that was not the case, then the grid-lock be…

The article actually specifically calls out agriculture in China: "The Chinese resistance cases were down to overuse of antibiotics in agriculture."

A number of sources I've found indicate that (see links below for sources): 1) China consumes about 50% of the total global antibiotic production (roughly half for agriculture and half for human use). 2) Per capita human consumption of antibiotics is on the order of 10 times greater in China compared to the US.

Some of these articles are several years old, and from sources I'd classify as more internal than foreign. It is likely that these figures would be conservative.

If this data is approximately correct, I think we could say that 1) China has an outsized effect on the problem of antibiotic resistance (even considering it's large population). 2) The US problem of antibiotic use is mostly an agricultural one (which deserves a lot of attention), and the Chinese overuse of antibiotics is not confined to either human or agricultural use.

I'm sure the chinese leadership is aware of the issue, and given their ability to make changes when something is very important (ie, air pollution during high profile events), the fact that little has been done is telling. It is likely that this simply isn't a high priority issue and thus we are unlikely to see any movement on it anytime soon.

http://china.org.cn/china/2015-07/14/content_36057168.htm http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/2015-07/14/c_134411007.htm http://content.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2103733,00...

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#32

Post by robotkilla »

jMyles wrote: post #13
placeybordeaux wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This needs to be done on a global scale and we haven't even made progress on that in the US. How do we start?

It sounds cruel, but I think we need to call people out when they eat factory meat.

I'm actually tired of the "blame the general public" argument. Blame the agricultural industry for this. I'm not going to take the blame for deforestation or lack of fresh water every time I eat a cheesburger, nor am I going to assume blame for pollution when I drive my car. Unless billions of people change within the next few years (which is so unrealistic that I feel comfortable saying it won't happen) then my individual do-gooder actions will only bring self-satisfaction, not real change.

Blaming the every-man for this stuff is a cop out. Corporations are to blame. Real change will only come about through government (semi-likely) or self-regulation within industries (very unlikely).

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#33

Post by jMyles »

tptacek wrote: post #27
arethuza wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having had my son suffer from an antibiotic resistant eye infection, if its a choice between low cost meat and useful antibiotics I'll go for the latter every time. It's not like anyone in Europe or the US is actually suffering from a lack of meat is it? [He's fine - but we were terrified he might lose the sight in one eye for a while].

I am not suggesting that antibiotics in meat are a good thing, but I am pointing out the reality that antibiotic-free meat is a luxury item.

antibiotic-free meat is a luxury item.

Unless you hunt.

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#34

Post by cbeach »

Studies show that immigration, sadly, is linked to the spread of antibiotic-resistant diseases.

Example: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/25418572/

Immigrant hotspots in London now have tuberculosis rates higher than Iraq and Rwanda. 80% of cases are people born abroad, and some are antibiotic-resistant. This is a disease we thought we'd erradicated:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-34637968

The U.K. has seen unprecedented inflows in the last year (640K immigrants), and since then the rate has risen further - to the point where the government has refused to publish official immigration figures because it would be "unhelpful" to our negotiation with the EU, and upcoming referendum on EU membership

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/1205...

I know how alarmist this comment sounds, and I fully expect it to be downvoted because it contradicts the politically-correct utopian vision of immigration that we're all expected to hold.

But I hope lefties realise that it's their suppression of debate that frustrates people and leads them supporting reactionary leaders like Trump.

We need to start discussing immigration without the stifling constraints of political correctness.

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#35

Post by jMyles »

tptacek wrote: post #30
jMyles wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Come on now. Don't make it about that. If you can't afford real meat, then you can't afford meat. Nobody says that people who can't afford a catalytic converter deserve an exemption allowing them to spew more carbon from their cars. This is the same dynamic, but far, far worse.

I see the isomorphism between catalytic converters and animal protein, but there's a pretty big difference between requiring people to pay more for cars and telling them they can't buy chicken at Aldi anymore. I think shaming people for buying cheap meat is a terrible strategy that will backfire. What needs to change are the regulations. When antibiotics are banned from the food supply, the market will discover other…

tptacek,

It seems to me that, in every thread, you find a way to dream that more "regulations" will solve all of the social ills of the US and beyond.

The agri-industrial complex is perhaps the clearest example that the powerful among the regulated will find a way to be the regulators. What more needs to happen to clarify this for you?

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#36

Post by jMyles »

robotkilla wrote: post #32
jMyles wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds cruel, but I think we need to call people out when they eat factory meat.

I'm actually tired of the "blame the general public" argument. Blame the agricultural industry for this. I'm not going to take the blame for deforestation or lack of fresh water every time I eat a cheesburger, nor am I going to assume blame for pollution when I drive my car. Unless billions of people change within the next few years (which is so unrealistic that I feel comfortable saying it won't happen) then my indi…

I don't mean to discount your worldview, because I think that you are correct in your basic assessment (massive change is required, not just you), but this comment reads like a giant excuse.

It's plain to see that eating a factory cheeseburger does indeed cause this ill. It's not some strange economic abstraction, but an easy-to-see, real world example.

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#38

Post by robotkilla »

placeybordeaux wrote: post #7
mschuster91 wrote: post #5

How about the most obvious solution: Stop keeping (farm) animals in conditions that require mass antibiotic feedings for the animals to survive?!

This needs to be done on a global scale and we haven't even made progress on that in the US. How do we start?

regulations through government. remove agricultural lobbyists from washington. raise awareness and turn it into a hot button topic that people in the US government have to address. fine the hell out of agricultural companies who have ruined our planet and stop putting the onus on individuals.

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#39

Post by vanilla-almond »

mschuster91 wrote: post #12
placeybordeaux wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This needs to be done on a global scale and we haven't even made progress on that in the US. How do we start?

Well the current problematic situation of animals is relatively well contained to the Western sphere (US, EU, maybe China). The Chinese already recognize the effects on nature, the EU too (and iirc they're already beginning to introduce measures), the biggest problem is and always will be the US because of the huge influence of the farming lobby on US politics (and even if that was not the case, then the grid-lock be…

"the biggest problem is and always will be the US"

Did you see the chart from another poster above? Many European countries like Germany, Spain, Portugal, Italy have very high levels of antibiotic usage in agriculture

http://i.imgur.com/9ybmhwE.jpg

I live in Europe, and am well aware of the common belief among many Europeans that we have excellent and high animal welfare standards. But the reality is that animal welfare standards also vary greatly between countries.

That chart above clearly demolishes the view that overuse of antibiotics is a problem principally for non-European countries.

Re: Bacteria that resist 'last antibiotic' found in UK

#40

Post by tptacek »

jMyles wrote: post #33
tptacek wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not suggesting that antibiotics in meat are a good thing, but I am pointing out the reality that antibiotic-free meat is a luxury item.

antibiotic-free meat is a luxury item. Unless you hunt.

If you're proposing a law that allows the people who buy chicken at Aldi to hunt people who want to shame them for doing it, I'm right there with you.
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