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HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

arstechnica.com

41–50 of 67 posts

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#41
post #18

The great thing is that it doesn't use SMR. I have an 8TB SMR from Seagate and its write performance is bad and variable, much like the pre-TRIM SSDs. It's ok if you write a lot of stuff and then just read it (you can get >100MB/s out of it), but I often see small random writes (updates) at 3-4 IOPS, because it has to re-shingle the whole track.

SMR drives are designed to be used in low-write environments such as archival, so bad performance for small random writes is to be expected.

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#42
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you're not sure what this means, our product is Not For You. Hey, thanks! I stopped reading there. :)

We both win!

That's a refreshing attitude. I wish AWS had something like that warning... "If you only want a VPS to idle in IRC with... stop reading, this is not for you."

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could always open them in a larger helium chamber.

Which would add a significant up-front cost that would have to be shouldered by the data recovery company. Potentially an issue for small shops (which most data recovery companies are.)

Get one of those vacuum sealing luggage bags, cut holes in side and glue in some rubber gloves into these holes. Put drive and tools in. Vacuum seal it, then Fill with helium you get from the party store.

Wear gloves, pickup tools and dismantle drive.

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#44
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

why it can't be vacuumed?

In a vacuum, the head would crash into the platter. The gas provides a cushion. Flying height these days is something like 3nm (yes, you read that right), so the tiniest vibration could cause a head crash in a vacuum.

> Flying height these days is something like 3nm (yes, you read that right), so the tiniest vibration could cause a head crash in a vacuum.

Wikipedia goes on to say the head could crash into a fingerprint or _smoke particle! So... how did my spinning rust laptop drive ever survive on my lap?

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#45
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but at say 1/10th atm Nitrogen would seem to work. So, the question becomes why is helium significantly better?

> at say 1/10th atm Nitrogen would seem to work But then you have to have a case strong enough not to bend under the pressure difference. At 1 atm, of course, helium has much lower density (and therefore lower viscosity). Nitrogen weighs 28 g/mol; helium just 4 g/mol.

So in measurements of standard helium rubber party balloons, how many drives could one fill with Helium from one such balloon?

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#46
post #2

As a provider of cloud storage (who actually owns the infrastructure) this is both exciting and frustrating... Exciting because we love the idea of deploying a 450TB zpool in a 4U chassis ... Frustrating because we will have to keep reworking our price per GB. With that in mind, our new attic/borg[1] support has dropped down to 3 cents per GB, per month to kind-of-sort-of match S3 pricing[2]. [1] http://www.stavros.i…

Which of Attic or Borg would you recommend for new usage? Deduplicated always-incremental backups have appealed to me ever since I started following the development of obnam, and I'd love to switch away from duplicity and stop requiring periodic full backups.

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#47
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but at say 1/10th atm Nitrogen would seem to work. So, the question becomes why is helium significantly better?

> at say 1/10th atm Nitrogen would seem to work But then you have to have a case strong enough not to bend under the pressure difference. At 1 atm, of course, helium has much lower density (and therefore lower viscosity). Nitrogen weighs 28 g/mol; helium just 4 g/mol.

What about Hydrogen? Too reactive with metals?

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#48
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SuperMicro has 72 drives in a single system, with 10TB drives you are hitting 720TB in a single 4U package. Dell also has their DSS7000, which is 90 drives in a 4U system, so 900 TB in a single 4U package... 9 Petabyte of storage in a single 42U rack...

Once you go past the 45 drive JBOD (which costs $2000 give or take) the price per slot starts to go up quickly ... the last quote we had for the supermicro 90 drive JBOD was $9000. So if you are optimizing for rackspace, it might make sense, but if you're keeping costs down, the 45 drive chassis is the best bet.

Have you considered using the Backblaze pods?

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#49
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

SuperMicro has 72 drives in a single system, with 10TB drives you are hitting 720TB in a single 4U package. Dell also has their DSS7000, which is 90 drives in a 4U system, so 900 TB in a single 4U package... 9 Petabyte of storage in a single 42U rack...

Once you go past the 45 drive JBOD (which costs $2000 give or take) the price per slot starts to go up quickly ... the last quote we had for the supermicro 90 drive JBOD was $9000. So if you are optimizing for rackspace, it might make sense, but if you're keeping costs down, the 45 drive chassis is the best bet.

The Dell DSS7000 chassis without the computer nodes on the back (which are a requirement (45 drives per compute node)) is cheaper than the 90 disk JBOD from SuperMicro. I can't disclose pricing, but it may be worth reaching out to Dell for what they can offer there.

You might be able to get better density for similar pricing. Just a suggestion :-)

Re: HGST beats Seagate to market with helium-filled 10TB hard drive

#50
post #8
post #2

As a provider of cloud storage (who actually owns the infrastructure) this is both exciting and frustrating... Exciting because we love the idea of deploying a 450TB zpool in a 4U chassis ... Frustrating because we will have to keep reworking our price per GB. With that in mind, our new attic/borg[1] support has dropped down to 3 cents per GB, per month to kind-of-sort-of match S3 pricing[2]. [1] http://www.stavros.i…

(who actually owns the infrastructure) Hipster

By Hipster you must mean "intelligent business owner not throwing money away".

Storage is cheap when you own it vs renting it: https://i.imgur.com/WZriUP5.jpg

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