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Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

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Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#21

Post by hatsix »

blubbi2 wrote: post #11
JoshTriplett wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And, managing dependencies is like dealing with explosives anyways... Only funny for anyone who hasn't been affected by one, or had friends or family who were. Still better to avoid names with negative connotations (and search for them first to check). > Any suggestions are more than welcome! A few ideas: bpm - Better Package Manager edge - the thing that connects nodes jpm - Javascript Package Manager ppm - Peer P…

As I said earlier, it wasn't my intention to name it after a weapon. That being said, it's a three letter name. It's very unlikely NOT to run into naming conflicts here. edge - taken by Microsoft jpm - JPMorgan ppm - taken by Perl package manager: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perl_package_manager fpm - taken by Effing package management: https://github.com/jordansissel/fpm bpm - beats per minute ayp - terrible to ty…

Yeah, but when people do a google search for IED, what are they going to find?

I'd worry less about offending someone because they had to type it, and more about SEO. I'd stick with things that don't have pictures of gore and destruction on the first page of search results.

So, that's a really good reason to not.

Also, your response was shitty... You specifically state that you chose IED because it's "easy to type"... but when someone says "Hey, that's what we call bombs that insurgents use to kill people with", you reply "Yeah, but the alternative is an acronym used by JP Morgan... People getting offended by me naming something after a way to kill people are being over the top". If "IED" happened to actually mean something, fine, make a case... but it isn't actually easier to type than anything else... If you want that, name it ASD, which shouldn't have any conflicts, as the top google search result is Anchorage School District... and I couldn't find any conflicting package names.

I get it, people are constantly picking on things and suggesting that they need to be more PC... but in this case, there is absolutely NO reason for you to stick with the name IED... and several reasons to change it (SEO, offensiveness, typability).

Also, good news for german companies... The news has started using different acronyms for ISIS... I've seen IS and ISIL in regards to the paris bombings, as they're more true to the literal translation.

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#22

Post by blubbi2 »

crabasa wrote: post #19

> The easiest way to install ied is using npm Bootstrapping ftw.

The initial set of dependencies is being installed via npm, the it installs its own dependencies via ied if told so: https://github.com/alexanderGugel/ied#installation

This is a "cool" feature during development, since it's a nice proof of concept.

Originally I checked in the node_modules directory, but then reddit was shitting on me as usual (yes, you shouldn't check in node_modules in an actual app, but this is PACKAGE MANAGER!). As far as I know, npm has also its own dependencies check in + a ton of packages as tarballs for tests, so I might do that later.

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#23

Post by dozzie »

diggan wrote: post #5
blubbi2 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Damn. Didn't think of that. In fact I literally just renamed it: https://github.com/alexanderGugel/ied/commit/84628b3c871c85d... Originally it was called mpm, but I figured that would have been pretty confusing, but it looks like the new name isn't necessarily better. I'm pretty terrible at naming. Any suggestions are more than welcome!

I think it's fine as it is. Could have chosen a worse name for sure! And, managing dependencies is like dealing with explosives anyways...

This is why developers should try to avoid introducing dependencies. Not at all costs, of course, but typical project in JavaScript, Go, Ruby, or Python has way, way too many dependencies, while little of them have any significant benefit.

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#24

Post by msutherl »

diggan wrote: post #5
blubbi2 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Damn. Didn't think of that. In fact I literally just renamed it: https://github.com/alexanderGugel/ied/commit/84628b3c871c85d... Originally it was called mpm, but I figured that would have been pretty confusing, but it looks like the new name isn't necessarily better. I'm pretty terrible at naming. Any suggestions are more than welcome!

I think it's fine as it is. Could have chosen a worse name for sure! And, managing dependencies is like dealing with explosives anyways...

This post will attract those of conservative/libertarian mentality who like to stand for our right to use language that may offend people, but I just want to add another vote for changing the name.

I am not particularly sensitive to these things, but upon reading the name, an image came to mind of a soldier leaning against a concrete wall on a dusty urban street, leg recently blown off, bleeding out, in shock. That image is now permanently associated with your project for me :)

For comparison, imagine if you'd called it "iud". At least in American society, this is more readily agreed to be offensive because of our sex taboo and gender inequality.

For a lot of people, the thought of war evokes deep visceral feelings of horror and fear. Such people will be less likely to use your project, which you could argue is a form of discrimination, and in any case doesn't benefit anyone.

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#25

Post by loktarogar »

diggan wrote: post #14
JoshTriplett wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And, managing dependencies is like dealing with explosives anyways... Only funny for anyone who hasn't been affected by one, or had friends or family who were. Still better to avoid names with negative connotations (and search for them first to check). > Any suggestions are more than welcome! A few ideas: bpm - Better Package Manager edge - the thing that connects nodes jpm - Javascript Package Manager ppm - Peer P…

I don't think the name is supposed to be funny. If you're afraid of naming things something just because someone, somewhere in the world have been affected by what you're naming your thing, you'll run out of names.

So yeah, throw your hands up and don't even try. It's not even worth trying. No, don't even put in a sliver of effort.

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#26

Post by babuskov »

blubbi2 wrote: post #4
macmac wrote: post #2

Unfortunate naming ie https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Improvised_explosive_device

Damn. Didn't think of that. In fact I literally just renamed it: https://github.com/alexanderGugel/ied/commit/84628b3c871c85d... Originally it was called mpm, but I figured that would have been pretty confusing, but it looks like the new name isn't necessarily better. I'm pretty terrible at naming. Any suggestions are more than welcome!

Leave it as it is. It will be much easier to memorize.

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#27

Post by msutherl »

dozzie wrote: post #23
diggan wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's fine as it is. Could have chosen a worse name for sure! And, managing dependencies is like dealing with explosives anyways...

This is why developers should try to avoid introducing dependencies. Not at all costs, of course, but typical project in JavaScript, Go, Ruby, or Python has way, way too many dependencies, while little of them have any significant benefit.

What's the downside? I think it's great. More modularity + distributed responsibility = better.

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#29

Post by estill01 »

babuskov wrote: post #26
blubbi2 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Damn. Didn't think of that. In fact I literally just renamed it: https://github.com/alexanderGugel/ied/commit/84628b3c871c85d... Originally it was called mpm, but I figured that would have been pretty confusing, but it looks like the new name isn't necessarily better. I'm pretty terrible at naming. Any suggestions are more than welcome!

Leave it as it is. It will be much easier to memorize.

Fully disagree. Really unfortunate/distasteful name - distracts from what I'm sure is a great project (see: conversation in this thread).

Re: Show HN: ied – an alternative package manager for Node

#30

Post by mitchty »

loktarogar wrote: post #25
diggan wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think the name is supposed to be funny. If you're afraid of naming things something just because someone, somewhere in the world have been affected by what you're naming your thing, you'll run out of names.

So yeah, throw your hands up and don't even try. It's not even worth trying. No, don't even put in a sliver of effort.

Its more the case that the set of people that could take offense to something is effectively infinite.

Say the programmer has english as a second language, its really easy not to know "common" things like this. Taking outrage in these cases is not in very good faith as the presumption is that the name is the same thing as the acronym in question.

Lets say they chose to name it baa, and people reacted to it thusly:

    - what is this implying all users are sheep! needs to be changed/boycotted
    - ...
    - this makes no sense, name it after its function xyz.
    - this is a horrible name, I'm going to encourage everyone I know not to use this
Sometimes people CANNOT be pleased or appeased or even bargained with when they respond to things from the pathos mindset. Make an effort sure but recently people seem to be going out of their way to be offended. As a fan of debate and arguing I hate that the presumption in these debates presumes bad intent. That style of thinking eventually leads to a very closed mindset.
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