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State of emergency in France

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Re: State of emergency in France

#171
post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't try to do that. I just think that conflict fueling unrest more than anything else. And it's lot easier to imagine Israel to disappear than to imagine half of Islamic world to disappear.

> I just think that conflict fueling unrest more than anything else. Despite the attention it receives, Israel is actually a pretty localized issue. It has very little to do with the biggest conflicts in the Middle East. If Israel weren't around, Syria would still be destabilized and we would still have ISIS. Also, your rhetoric around wiping Israel off the map kind of gives your agenda away.

> If Israel weren't around, Syria would still be destabilized and we would still have ISIS.

Are you sure?

According to the founding father of Zionism Theodore Herzl, “the area of the Jewish State stretches: “From the Brook of Egypt to the Euphrates.” According to Rabbi Fischmann, “The Promised Land extends from the River of Egypt up to the Euphrates, it includes parts of Syria and Lebanon.”

When viewed in the current context, the war on Iraq, the 2006 war on Lebanon, the 2011 war on Libya, the ongoing war on Syria and Iraq, the war in Yemen, the process of regime change in Egypt, must be understood in relation to the Zionist Plan for the Middle East. The latter consists in weakening and eventually fracturing neighboring Arab states as part of an Israeli expansionist project.

The Zionist project supports the Jewish settlement movement. More broadly it involves a policy of excluding Palestinians from Palestine leading to the eventual annexation of both the West Bank and Gaza to the State of Israel.

According to Mahdi Darius Nazemroaya in a 2011 Global Research article, The Yinon Plan was a continuation of Britain’s colonial design in the Middle East:

“[The Yinon plan] is an Israeli strategic plan to ensure Israeli regional superiority. It insists and stipulates that Israel must reconfigure its geo-political environment through the balkanization of the surrounding Arab states into smaller and weaker states.

Re: State of emergency in France

#172
post #162
post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any belief system theistic or not can become fanatical and violent as soon as it's followers become obsessed and decide that the end justifies the means. The 20th century saw quite a few atheistic or at least non religious political ideologies behaving no better than this. Radical Islam today seems to be doing all the same things that radical fascists and Marxists did in the 20th century.

> Radical Islam But there are plenty of other radical groups. Today the right wing extremists are a greater threat to Americans than Muslims are.

Is this really true? I don't argue that home grown fanatics are not a threat, but I don't see a current organized systemic effort from them to do much of anything other than squawk on the net.

The lone nut shooter epidemic is something else. It's not ideological. Seems to be more of a mental health issue.

Re: State of emergency in France

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I strongly vote for #1. The attack, while tragic, was small-scale, and should not be treated as anything else as organized crime. Have the police find all responsible and bring them to justice. Anything else is basically doing what the terrorists want you to do - overreact. We should learn from the mistakes of the United States: two long, bloody and expensive wars, bombing third country and terrorizing fourth, mass s…

I would be interested to see what you would think of this, your statement, if you were holding the dismembered body of your father, mother, sib,ing or loved one in your arms. Dead. Our free societies do not no Eed to change. Theirs do. And the solution is very simple. The problem is nobody has the balls and determination to do it. There's a fundamental incompatibiliti between ideologies and behavior. Being poor, uned…

> The delusional stone age brutal inhuman apes pushing around nonsense have to.

"They're stone-age apes, so LET'S BEHAVE EXACTLY LIKE THEM, ganging up and kicking the crap out of them with the biggest club we can find." What a superior, enlightened approach! We shall begin preparations henceforth. Oh wait, we're already bombing "them" back into the Stone Age...

Re: State of emergency in France

#174
post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're asking for more ideas and this is something I've had to painstakingly talk to people about all day, so here's a shot at this. First of all, identify the problem. Why are there terrorist attacks? Saying "religious nuttery" achieves nothing. Nuttery always exists but is in majority not enough to push people to suicide bombings. Terrorist attacks exist because of political power and influence. They're efficient,…

Except these don't appear to be a political terrorist group, like the ones we have in Europe. This is jihad, blind violence, without targeting political figures. If you ask the bombers why they do it they 'll barely be able to answer beyond some religious nonsense. If you ask the ones who sent them to bomb, i bet you will find a mixture of vague anti-westernism , anti-semitism etc. Whoever is funding them does not ha…

> This is jihad, blind violence

This might be a war operation. It is very effective to sacrifice eight soldiers to make the whole army retreat. And other countries might be scared too and withdraw their troops.

> If you ask the ones who sent them to bomb, i bet you will find a mixture of vague anti-westernism , anti-semitism etc.

France is in a war against IS. So they fight with their enemy.

> it's hard to come up with solutions to fix the broken arab world

What about restraining from using force? Using diplomatic and economic measures?

Re: State of emergency in France

#175
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks. I was genuinely curious. To me "power projection" in itself is morally very questionable. Even without terrorist attacks. Unfortunately modern geopolitics is more Machiavellian than Machiavelli himself was.

Not stopping genocide is morally questionable too. And that's what Assad and IS have been doing.

It's not just morally questionable, it's outright wrong.

Unfortunately trying to stop genocide with violence and failing miserably is even more wrong. On the other hand using supposed genocide as excuse to forward geopolitical interests would also be wrong.

Given how Vietnam, Afghanistan, or Iraq wars have turned out, I'm not in favor of meddling. Given how nobody gave single fuck about Khmer rouge, I don't believe in genuine good will in geopolitics. So I'm not giving my permission to anybody to conduct air strikes in Syria, but they won't ask me either. Only air strike that gets my approval is dropping several tonnes of polyurethane to Dabiq.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isi...

Re: State of emergency in France

#177
Time for Europe to really take care of its backyard in the MENA.

Its policy of supporting despots and tyrants, the latest of which was Sisi of Egypt ,to contain the radicals and terrorists, that they engender with their oppressive policies on an industrial scale, has to change course soon.

Time for the European leaders to have some faith in the people of the region that they would make a better future for themselves (Tunisia as an example) and not fall victim to perpetual and vicious cycle of violence as they fear or have led to believe.

I know that Europeans are in a very precarious situation between a rock and a hard place where they know that tyrants are using them and holding the security of their southern border as hostage and that they have to turn a blind eye to their sytemic repression and prosecution of opposition in exchange of not having to worry about taking considerable and resource draining measures to secure the borders but on the other hand these very tyrants have set domestic policies and failing economic programs that are breeding more and more of these terrorists and desperate people by the day that they are no longer can contain and put on leash i.e. increase in aggregate numbers and the hit ratio for terrorists, not to mention that this plays in the tyrants' hands increasing the leverage they have worsening the awful even more.

Like with the movement to decriminalize/legalize marijuana in the west, it's time for Europeans to exert more influence to legalize the aspirations and legitimate demands of people in the MENA region for living in a true democracy and free society and not be intimidated by the threats of tyrants and despots.

Time to operate on this ever-swelling cyst in the region before it explodes in everyone's face and infect everything that it touches. I know that it will be very messy and painful esp in the beginning but as we say here and I paraphrase "Going through pain for an hour is better than having it every hour"

Help us to help you.

Re: State of emergency in France

#179
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am very hesitant to call Israel's policies successful in the bigger picture, but I'll respectfully decline that entire debate.

junto said: > We could try and close all the borders... or... kick all immigrants out of our countries mbrock said: > Draconian measures... historically unsuccessful... [establishing those measures] also grievously violates the core principles of an open and liberal society... Vehemently disagreeing with your opinion is a crucial necessity for anyone who stands for democracy and liberty. Dolores12 said: > It is actua…

The Hacker News guidelines say:

"Please avoid introducing classic flamewar topics unless you have something genuinely new to say about them."

I really don't.

Re: State of emergency in France

#180

Multiculturalism has failed. One of the gunmen (or should I say gun-people for the feminists) landed in Greece as a "refugee". https://twitter.com/GreekAnalyst/status/665558503528882176

This has nothing to do with multiculturalism. Radical Islam is the issue here, not multiculturalism.
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