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Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

independent.co.uk

121–130 of 166 posts

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#121
post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Caffeine? Sugar? Lol! How about mice poison? Reading wikipedia and actually knowing stuff about drugs are very different things. Please stop posting, you don't have a clue.

You focused on the least important part of what I wrote then resort to ad hominem attacks. There is no sensible conversation to be had here.

I don't want to have a conversation with you. You don't know the first thing about the subject. Why would I want to talk to you about it?

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#122
post #60
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Couldn't agree more but I don't think it has to do with capitalism, but economics. Regardless of the system in place, if there is a high enough demand for a product, as there is drugs, there will be a supply. An interesting example is how drug use is actually rampant in US prisons, some of the most controlled environments in the country. No ones idea of a free market capitalism, but somehow drugs are still very acces…

the one I know for sure about involved visitation. wives and girlfriends are asked to smuggle something in for a significant other inside of themselves. a toilet trip later it gets removed and passed off, and voila. even a small amount can curry quite a bit of favor and of course cash. because of the risk involved, the price is well marked up. seems like the guards would have to be on the take, though, because I'm no…

my guess is that guards turn a half blind eye, something to do with being more easier to control a prison where inmates are allowed some degree of freedom and self organizing. I'll research this later, it's an interesting subject.

some interesting stuff that came up while looking trough research material:

http://www.garysturt.free-online.co.uk/zimbardo.htm simulated prison experiment going downhilll

this one is about cigarettes and seem to support the point: http://tpj.sagepub.com/content/81/2/142.short

"This study describes how bans can transform largely benign cigarette “gray markets,” where cigarettes are used as a currency, into more problematic black markets, where cigarettes are a highly priced commodity."

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#123
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meth and Heroin addicts tend to be poorer and prone to criminal activity, than pharmaceutical amphetamine and opiate users. Additionally, adverse reactions, are more likely when the drug is unregulated.

Do you know how much 1g of heroin cost?

It's been a while since I knew people who did heroin, but the people I knew who did it bought it in packs and bundles not grams. One dose (pack) was ~10$ and a bundle which, I think was, 12 doses was ~100$. And if memory serves me correctly Oxycontin was like ~30$ a pill. Too many of the people I used to know died from it, and I frequently think about how things could have been different for the people who overdosed and the people around them were afraid to call for help because it would have put them in criminal jeopardy.

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

well selling is illegal, so its not legal per se.

If they're being specific on 'profiting' then in theory dealers could 'donate' their stashes to addicts and write it off against the tax man :D

Every (afaik) country currently classifies distribution as that word is defined - giving drugs to a friend for free is just as illegal as selling them to a stranger for profit. Possibly treated more leniently, I don't know, but not legally different.

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#125
post #63

It is a step in the right direction, but it still half-baked. Without decriminalizing production as well, they are maintaining a monopoly for those that works outside of the law. Which means a very profitable tax free market that has to recreate all of the state features like physical safety and insurance policies from scratch. Every nation that forbids something that is in demand, is gestating its own competition. T…

Socialist revolutions happen overnight but capitalist changes need to happen over time. In case of India it took 50 years for the government to realize that it is nonsensical to restrict how many nut bolts a factory could produce.

As opposed to, say, capitalist revolutions that happen overnight and socialist changes that happen over time? What's the point of adding "emotional" qualifiers to truisms?

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#126

It is a step in the right direction, but it still half-baked. Without decriminalizing production as well, they are maintaining a monopoly for those that works outside of the law. Which means a very profitable tax free market that has to recreate all of the state features like physical safety and insurance policies from scratch. Every nation that forbids something that is in demand, is gestating its own competition. T…

> Which means a very profitable tax free market That's totally untrue. Drug lords still have to contend with law enforcement raids and busts or bribing govt officials for their goods and products to "reach the consumer" constituting in effect a tax on their operations.

That's only a tax in the very narrow sense that it keeps prison officers and policemen in jobs. I want the money to go towards general taxation. In Britain some £6bn is spent on cannabis each year. Taking a third of that in tax raises enough to reverse half of the chancellor's very controversial recent cuts to tax credits.

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#127
post #120
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotes are not a valid citation. Heroin is the most harmful drug, statistically, according to numerous studies.

Do you have links to those studies? A lot of the harm from heroin come from adulterants which are injected, causing abscess; or from the illegality of providing clean needles and injection advice and safe spaces to inject which causes infection etc; or from the illegality of providing maintenance doses from doctors which cause people to burgle or sex work to get money to buy the drug. Heroin is undoubtedly an unwise…

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-67...

http://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-67...

http://bmjopen.bmj.com/content/2/4/e000774.full.html#T1

There are more, but freely accessing journals online is troublesome. I have NEVER seen any study say heroin is anything but one of the most crippling and dangerous addictions. I am still waiting for anyone to cite one...

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#128
post #63

It is a step in the right direction, but it still half-baked. Without decriminalizing production as well, they are maintaining a monopoly for those that works outside of the law. Which means a very profitable tax free market that has to recreate all of the state features like physical safety and insurance policies from scratch. Every nation that forbids something that is in demand, is gestating its own competition. T…

Socialist revolutions happen overnight but capitalist changes need to happen over time. In case of India it took 50 years for the government to realize that it is nonsensical to restrict how many nut bolts a factory could produce.

USSR and the Eastern Bloc fell quickly.

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd really love if this were the case, but sadly it really isn't. The affect of US tech companies coming here has largely been a small-scale version of Palo Alto-esque gentrification of a small area of Dublin (docklands) and any improvements in standard of living being limited to a small white male tech elite. Overall poverty is up (we're dealing with a very serious recent homelessness crisis) and average standards o…

Thanks for the inside perspective - hard to get a real sense of how a country is doing from GDP/economic indicators. Wishful thinking on my part that tech wealth would trickle down more effectively in Ireland than in the US. On the homelessness crisis: Amazing that housing prices in Dublin have jumped up 22.3% YoY. [1] What else do you see contributing to the rise in poverty/homelessness and the decline in living sta…

House price rises have mostly been due to the near complete decimation of the housing construction market in recently years. About 10% of houses were completed compared to 10 years ago. There is very little supply and a pent up demand. Combine that with non-existant tenant protection, and a middle class who invested in property and want/need to see some improvement in their income.

Re: Ireland to 'decriminalise' small amounts of drugs for personal use

#130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can see the UK leaning on them > Hopefully Ireland will give their former (hell, > ongoing) occupiers the finger I think you vastly over-estimate the importance of Ireland to the British government.

I take it you missed the bit where they fought a few dozen wars over the last century?

Oh, Imperial Britain had a war with Ireland? That must make Ireland special!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/history/9653497/British-have-inva...

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