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Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

mashable.com

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Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#31

Post by brudgers »

Forty years ago, I was bused across Fairfax County. Apart from a few kids in the same swath of suburbs, my classmates were bused in from other parts. I keep in touch with some of them via Facebook. They were amazing kids and are for the most part amazing middle aged adults.

The striking difference between my experience and that described in the article is that the educational structure of The Center was not competitive. They were just normal elementary school classrooms other than the level of the content. There are only two plausible reasons that I didn't experience the idea that some kids were dumber than others, either it didn't happen or I was the dumbest and the other kids were compassionate and kind.

Five year olds don't feel pressure to get into the best kindergarden. It's some adult's bright idea to sanction eight year olds competing on spelling day in and out. Once a year for the Scripps National Spelling Bee is plenty enough if not too much. My son goes to school with children who don't get dinner if they get a B on a math test and others whose parents have picked their majors before middle school...in STEM of course.

Yet I think the the most awesome of my classmates from all those years ago are an historian and a public school teacher.

Ducunt volentem fata nolentem trahunt. Seneca.

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#32

Post by jahewson »

baldfat wrote: post #8
cuckcuckspruce wrote: post #2

> I will never forget the day I mentioned to another mother my concern about lack of empathy and kindness among the students, and she told me: “That’s not the school’s job.” Is there nothing left that parents are meant to teach? Or is it all now the school's job? If so, why don't we go full Spartan and take the kids away from the parents right after they're born and have schools teach everything.

> why don't we go full Spartan and take the kids away from the parents right after they're born and have schools teach everything. I feel like that was the reason we had boarding school for the rich and apprenticeships in the early modern period. Children didn't stay with you in the city at around 12 you shipped them off to be an apprentices and live with the master or you went to a boarding school or college by 12 o…

The Victorians took this one step further, creating boarding schools for the middle classes to remove the children from "the noxious influence of home" (Nathaniel Woodard); an idea which had its roots in Presbyterian preechings.

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#33

Post by jkyle »

powertower wrote: post #22
astazangasta wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The schools are not their to raise the child, that is the parents' job. If primary education isn't child rearing, nothing is. Schools are absolutely there to raise the child.

> If primary education isn't child rearing, nothing is. Schools are absolutely there to raise the child. By that logic, what exactly is the parents job then?

> By that logic, what exactly is the parents job then?

Why must only one person have a duty to raise a child? For most of human history "it takes a village" was canon with regard to child rearing.

On most days of the week, a school is often responsible for the welfare of a child for more hours of the day than the parent. Seven or eight hours of school, several hours of after school activities.

How can you not see this activity as child rearing?

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#34

Post by RyanZAG »

DanBC wrote: post #13
Someone1234 wrote: post #11

You tell a kid they're smart: You've immediately set them up for long term failure. "Smart" is a quantifiable hard limit. The problem with smart people is that as soon as they run up against a challenge/concept/issue they cannot immediately overcome, they get frustrated, because they "should be smarter than this!" Which often results in avoidable frustration/anxiety/depression. You see this a lot. "Gifted" "smart" ki…

There are some English schools that have "failure" weeks. Here's one example from 2012. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-16879336 Other thing schools are doing is stopping children putting their hand up to answer a question. They just ask a child at random to try to answer. (In theory) wrong answers are fine, they're looking for the child to try to explain the answer they have. Praise effort, not achievement is us…

Got to say I've seen this practice done a lot, but never found it beneficial as a class exercise. Nobody really learns anything through this. The person being asked tends to panic and muddles through. The people in the class who don't understand try to follow and end up more confused. This can go through a few rounds with more wrong answers. Eventually the lecturer or a student will give the right answer but half the people have tuned out already or lost their train of thought.

I think it's a very bad way to learn anything. The actual method is sound when used outside of a lecture in one-on-one or small groups where everyone is involved, but fails terribly with large groups.

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#35

Post by el_fuser »

rsync wrote: post #28
astazangasta wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The schools are not their to raise the child, that is the parents' job. If primary education isn't child rearing, nothing is. Schools are absolutely there to raise the child.

">The schools are not their to raise the child, that is the parents' job. If primary education isn't child rearing, nothing is. Schools are absolutely there to raise the child." The schools are not their to raise the child, that is the parents' job.

Sure they are... Your kid spends 6-10 hours per day under their direction. Often they spend more time with kids than the kids' parents.

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#36

Post by setpatchaddress »

JackFr wrote: post #27
Someone1234 wrote: post #11

You tell a kid they're smart: You've immediately set them up for long term failure. "Smart" is a quantifiable hard limit. The problem with smart people is that as soon as they run up against a challenge/concept/issue they cannot immediately overcome, they get frustrated, because they "should be smarter than this!" Which often results in avoidable frustration/anxiety/depression. You see this a lot. "Gifted" "smart" ki…

> You tell a kid they're smart: You've immediately set them up for long term failure. Especially b/c the really smart ones know without being told.

Yes, narcissism can manifest early.

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#37

Post by jordigh »

Someone1234 wrote: post #11

You tell a kid they're smart: You've immediately set them up for long term failure. "Smart" is a quantifiable hard limit. The problem with smart people is that as soon as they run up against a challenge/concept/issue they cannot immediately overcome, they get frustrated, because they "should be smarter than this!" Which often results in avoidable frustration/anxiety/depression. You see this a lot. "Gifted" "smart" ki…

I was told I was smart a lot. I think it just made me lazy and cocky, thinking I could do anything easily without trying, so I didn't try at a lot of things. It didn't make me run away from hard problems, though. I still like those, and I enjoy the frustration of a difficult problem.[1]

It probably also didn't help that I lived a very sheltered life as an upper-class Mexican and everything that I wanted I could get by just asking. That has been another obstacle that has been difficult to overcome: learning how to do hard work and fend for myself.

--

[1] As long as the problem doesn't involve people, though, since people are not really a problem to be solved

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#38

Post by panglott »

powertower wrote: post #22
astazangasta wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The schools are not their to raise the child, that is the parents' job. If primary education isn't child rearing, nothing is. Schools are absolutely there to raise the child.

> If primary education isn't child rearing, nothing is. Schools are absolutely there to raise the child. By that logic, what exactly is the parents job then?

Also child rearing?

The largest single factor on a student's educational outcomes is not any in-school factor, but the educational background and socioeconomic status of their parents.

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#39

Post by morgante »

Honestly, this sounds like a terribly selfish move. The OP consciously took her son out of a bigger pond to put him into a smaller pool where he could shine again.

This completely ignores the fact that probably the best way to learn is to be surrounded by people more intelligent than yourself.

Speaking as someone who spent most of my childhood as "valedictorian" I would have craved a competitive peer group much sooner, despite the blow to my self-esteem which confrontation of my own fallibility created.

Re: Why I pulled my son out of a school for 'gifted' kids

#40

Post by gmarx »

jimktrains2 wrote: post #26
gmarx wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was kid people told me I was smart. I don't think I experienced any of this.

When I was a kid people told me I was smart. I'm almost 30 and _still_ struggle with _exactly_ what GP posted.

I know it isn't wise to ask about downvotes but why would people downvote me for stating what I experienced when it is relevant to the discussion? Can people not tolerate anything which deviates from the narratives in their heads?
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