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Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

latimes.com

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Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#41

Post by mediaman »

outworlder wrote: post #14
skorecky wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They address this in the article. > Tesla spokesman Ricardo Reyes said the Palo Alto automaker keeps in close communication with its customers to “proactively address issues, and quickly fix problems.”

Yeah, but do they? As far as companies go, I have a decent level of trust on statements by Tesla. But it is still a company, and that statement has to be independently evaluated.

Based on commentary in various owner forums, it seems that Tesla is handling these issues generally very well, and makes repairs without some of the common quibbling of a lot of dealerships. So while it's annoying to bring in the car frequently for problems, they do at least seem to be handling the problems well.

A lot of owners however seem concerned about what will happen after the warranty period, when these repairs start costing the owner.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#42

Post by bri3d »

pkorzeniewski wrote: post #27
simonsarris wrote: post #6

As Consumer Reports suggests, this is totally understandable. Straight from CR: > The Tesla wasn’t the only high-performance vehicle that fell below average in reliability. Others include the BMW X5 and 5 Series, and the Chevrolet Corvette. > When automakers roll out new technology, be it infotainment, transmissions, or engine variations, it often has a deleterious effect on vehicle reliability. Tesla is not only the…

I wouldn't take the owner satisfaction ratings too seriously, people who buy Tesla cars are mostly rich enthusiasts of new technologies and will quietly deal with a lot of issues before starting to criticize the car. If someone doesn't care about the electric engine, there's really no reason to buy a Tesla - for the same price you can get a much more luxurious german car with proven technology. It's similar to people…

From watching a few friends own Teslas, it seems that they offer a superior repair and maintenance experience to many German car dealers, which helps with owner satisfaction in the face of reliability issues. It certainly doesn't bode well for Tesla's attempt to move to high-volume, lower-margin production, though.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#43

Post by 6stringmerc »

Okay, I'll be sure to dial back my 'traditionalist' bent when it comes to vehicles and technology, it doesn't help make any points.

...but with the Model S as the 2nd iteration of a Tesla vehicle, and their first "ground up" model, how does this bode for the often stalled release of the Model X? It very much reminds me of issues faced by software companies, but there's some leeway being given to Tesla I don't think is really deserved. As in, if the last release was really buggy over the course of several years of fixes and patches (and the occasional feature removal like the swappable battery packs), then should expectations be tempered?

Anyway, I'll keep an eye on the company and what its products mean for the industry as a whole.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#44

Post by justin66 »

rafamvc wrote: post #3
orrsella wrote: post #2

Shares reportedly[1] down 10% due to report. [1] http://seekingalpha.com/news/2840766-tesla-lower-after-consu...

But still have 97% saying they would buy the car again? That is a statistic that doesnt match the claim that the cars arent good.

The customers having problems simply aren't making that claim.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#45

Post by tdees40 »

beat wrote: post #23
encoderer wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla's PE in 2016 is forecasted over 130. For comparison bmw is under 10. Tesla is priced for perfection.

Tesla is a growth company that could be a giant. BMW is a stable old blue chip. Different market values entirely. At the individual car level, Tesla S is priced to match mid/high end sedans from BMW, Mercedes, and Audi, so that's the quality level they need to hit. And such quality isn't about reliability so much as fit and finish. Tesla is doing extremely well against very established competition in that regard.

Tesla' market cap is $30B. GM is $53B. Ford is $61B. If you're buying Tesla, you have to believe that they will become a huge player, and soon. They can't just be bigger, they have to be huge or else you're radically overpaying for a niche producer.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#46

Post by cma »

encoderer wrote: post #31
beat wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla is a growth company that could be a giant. BMW is a stable old blue chip. Different market values entirely. At the individual car level, Tesla S is priced to match mid/high end sedans from BMW, Mercedes, and Audi, so that's the quality level they need to hit. And such quality isn't about reliability so much as fit and finish. Tesla is doing extremely well against very established competition in that regard.

Check out the PEG ratio, which factors in growth. Rapid and sustained growth is not guaranteed and bad press can inhibit it. But you need that growth to justify the valuation. Priced for perfection.

Isn't PEG just based on their existing growth within the luxury market, whereas they have publicized plans of entering mass market?

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#47

Post by kpwagner »

briandear wrote: post #36

I wonder how many CR editors shorter Tesla stock before this was published. It wouldn't even be considered insider trading. I don't really put much stock in CR, unfortunately, the markets did -- quite unfairly actually since most folks buying Teslas aren't doing comparison shopping using CR.

The number is zero. Any more than that would be a serious scandal--can't imagine that would be legal. Market manipulation is a pretty serious crime ever since the days of Jay Gould.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#48

Post by tdees40 »

I had a conversation with a (recently-departed) Tesla mechanic the other day (who has had experience working with every other type of car), and he said, "I knew every Tesla owner in the tri-state area on a first-name basis. Everything breaks." He did say that it's getting better with the newer models.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#49

Post by cpwright »

rafamvc wrote: post #3
orrsella wrote: post #2

Shares reportedly[1] down 10% due to report. [1] http://seekingalpha.com/news/2840766-tesla-lower-after-consu...

But still have 97% saying they would buy the car again? That is a statistic that doesnt match the claim that the cars arent good.

CR didn't say the car wasn't good, they said it wasn't reliable. The car performed very well on their tests related to the road; so it is fun to drive, safe, comfortable, etc.

The problem is that it breaks; and then you need to get it fixed. It seems Tesla is pretty good about fixing things without giving you trouble about it; so they make the negative experience into a positive/neutral one.

This leaves you with a good car, not reliable, but still with happy owners; so everything makes sense to me.

And the stock overreacts to all kinds of news, and it is true that reliability will matter as far as their future profits (if they keep everyone happy it costs a bunch; if they don't, they'll lose sales).

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#50

Post by 6stringmerc »

derekp7 wrote: post #11

Seeing as how the battery system is primarily what makes electric cars expensive, I really wish automakers would start delivering plugin hybrids that have, say 75 - 100 mile range on battery (to keep cost down), along with a very low horsepower gas engine. (Most plugin hybrids give you about 20 - 30 miles on battery). The way it would work: the battery would drive the front wheels, and you would use the battery for m…

As most of the responses will show, people aren't very fond of the idea.

I like it, but replace internal combustion engine with a micro turbine and the opportunities for a "better" hybrid system are extensive.

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