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Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

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Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#41

Post by pjc50 »

cabbeer wrote: post #7
steckerbrett wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no laser there. If there was a laser there it would be a significant hazard to everybody in the room, so it's good it's completely fake. With the sort of power you would need to be cutting hairs in any capacity simply looking at diffuse reflections (think a laser dot at a wall) would have the ability to permanently damage your vision. The video is someone fooling around with a piece of aluminum and a hot wire…

> It's a testament to human stupidity that something this blatant managed to get $4M. That's a bit harsh. Most people don't understand technology on a functional level. Ask a "regular" person how programming, the internet or their mobile phone works and they won't be able to give you a technical explanation. In fact, most modern technology tries to hide the internal workings.. "it just works".

People should be a lot more skeptical about crowdfunding anything they don't understand. It's not really a prepurchase and it's risky to treat it as such.

Heck, it's risky enough pre-ordering games from AAA studios.

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#42

Post by d23 »

DannoHung wrote: post #40

The thing that is weird about this case is that one of the principals, Morgan Gustavsson, is actually the dude who invented the real laser hair removal that is used in clinics and has been involved in dermatology since. I don't know if he was actually involved in this project or not, but that was the one thing that made me think that this maybe wasn't 100% a scam? Anyway, the implication they make in their pitch isn'…

> Of course, if this really is such a revolutionary advance, why go to Kickstarter to bring it to market? Why not traditional investors.

The obvious benefit being that you don't actually have to give Kickstarter "investors" any money back.

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#43

Post by Chathamization »

steckerbrett wrote: post #3
aram wrote: post #2

Since we all check the comments first, here are some links: KickStarter project page (suspended): https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/skarp/the-skarp-laser-r... IndieGoGo project page (they re-posted the project there after being suspended): https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/the-skarp-laser-razor-21s... Demonstration video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aOLwNJ7TXWA

There's no laser there. If there was a laser there it would be a significant hazard to everybody in the room, so it's good it's completely fake. With the sort of power you would need to be cutting hairs in any capacity simply looking at diffuse reflections (think a laser dot at a wall) would have the ability to permanently damage your vision. The video is someone fooling around with a piece of aluminum and a hot wire…

There seems to be a large number of people who are convinced that the only difference between the present day and a SciFi wonderland is human will. For example, look at the people who think Mars colonization is a good idea, or the popularity of Ray Kurzweil (and to a lesser extent, people who are overly optimistic about self-driving cars).

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#44

Post by steckerbrett »

vicbrooker wrote: post #33

Their prototype reminds me of concept car designs that look great but don't have enough internal space for an engine. You'd maybe fit a AAA battery in the handle but I haven't even seen a torch that works without more juice. Also, I was kind of suspicious when I noticed that more than half of the team have beards.

I doubt you could get more than a watt out of a AAA anyway.

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#45

Post by drzaiusapelord »

DannoHung wrote: post #40

The thing that is weird about this case is that one of the principals, Morgan Gustavsson, is actually the dude who invented the real laser hair removal that is used in clinics and has been involved in dermatology since. I don't know if he was actually involved in this project or not, but that was the one thing that made me think that this maybe wasn't 100% a scam? Anyway, the implication they make in their pitch isn'…

Still makes no sense. The heat/power requirements to burn off hair are ridiculous and dangerous to use. Look at those overpowered laser pointers that can barely pop a balloon. These devices can blind a person easily. Hair is much, much tougher and would require magnitudes more power.

>Morgan Gustavsson

Dunno, but people cash out all the time. Race car drivers endorsing crappy mass produced cars, etc. I'm especially critical of anyone nearing or at retirement age. There's a "give no fucks, give me easy money" attitude that kicks in around then, as well as worrying about taking care of those you love after you pass. Not to mention, these people being way past their prime and perhaps trying to chase old glories via questionable methods.

>why go to Kickstarter to bring it to market?

Lets assume the tech isn't all snake-oil. Maybe investors know things that Joe Blow Internet Geek doesn't. Concerns about safety, power usage, lawsuits, regulations, etc. This seems like a nice way to side-step informed investing and push all the high risk liabilities onto random schmucks.

Or its a "semi-scam." I watched the video of the prototype and its clear that its just cutting using a hot wire, which seems to be heated up via some kind of light source, perhaps a laser. Sure its a "laser" cut, but not exactly what people are expecting.

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#46

Post by frandroid »

delecti wrote: post #25
dogma1138 wrote: post #19

It's sad that people thought it was real, forget about lasers and stuff it's basic common sense. A AAA battery doesn't store enough power to drive a laser capable of burning hair for any reasonable amount of time. When the laser isn't interrupted by the hair it has to go some where which means that heat is produced, if it can get something hot enough to burn the hair off it would get hot enough that you won't be able…

I've done laser hair removal, and while it does hurt like a bitch, and does only work on dark hairs, the claims were that the razor would use a wavelength that targeted all hair (I don't know enough to say that's not plausible), and presumably they'd use a short enough focal length to only hit exposed hair, rather than the normal method of focusing on the hair below the surface. Doesn't get around the smell, power re…

If there already was a wavelength that targets all hair colour, they would use it already with other hair removal treatments, you'd think.

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#47

Post by DannoHung »

SXX wrote: post #13
anon4 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The guy invented Intense Pulsed Light, i.e. the laser technology used in hair removal, so it sounded plausible he might have found a way to cut hair with a lower-intensity laser. Even if it cut it slowly, it might be better than razors for a lot of people.

Did you found source on that? Only source that I managed to find it's website of company he founded long time ago: http://www.medicalbiocare.com/html/corporate.html Any other sources tell that IPL was invented by someone else.

He does have a patent from the mid 90's (which is when I think IPL was created?) that seems to be pertinent: https://www.google.com/patents/US5320618

I dunno, this whole thing is weird. Generally I have to defer to people saying that the system isn't using enough energy to burn hairs, but unless the guy in question has had some sort of mental break or something, I don't get why he'd be involved with it if it was a straight fraud.

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#48

Post by BinaryIdiot »

How can you prove to potential buyers that you're able to produce the product you're selling them if you can't create a prototype demonstrating that it works?

Let's say we take everything at face value and believe 100% they can do this and that it is not a scam. If there is no prototype it's still possible that it could not work as it's unproven.

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#49

Post by kyzyl »

steckerbrett wrote: post #11
k__ wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know much about lasers and the videos seemed convincing to me... Now I'm sad that it's a fake, even if I wanted to wait till the first version came out.

Light has a fun property of being bent when it passes through substances that have different optical densities. With some combinations of material and process we can exploit this property to achieve total internal reflection[0]. With a cylindrical glass rod we can fire light down it in such a way that it bounces off the walls and makes it to the far end without ever exiting through the sides. This is used in fiber op…

While I'm not making any statement about the feasibility of the Skarp, I think you might be exaggerating the size of a moderately powerful modern lasers. At my company's R&D lab I have some 1W CO2 lasers that, similar to what what you describe, are about the size of loaf of bread. They run on three phase power, have inch-thick cables and required hilariously large cooling shrouds. Two facts about those types of lasers: They are cavity lasers designed to have very good beam quality, and they are OLD.

I have a cabinet full of other types of newer, moderately powerful laser modules which vary from pin diodes to modules the size of a AA battery, to things the size of cigars. Some of them are pretty darned powerful. Any laser modules that are water cooled would DEFINITELY not be something you would want to hold up to your face, but I also don't think that's the kind of power required for cutting hair. I'm not saying that any laser running on a AAA battery at a useful power could last a useful amount of time, if you could figure out some secret sauce method for very quickly coupling a high intensity pulse (hairs have a very small area, after all) onto some hairs at a wavelength that they like to soak up then it seems.... possible. In theory the laser wavelength and power could even be tuned dynamically to match the hairs, that is if they had somehow figured out a way to fit a Mach-Zender modulator, an electro-optical modulator and a frequency comb into a razor handle--ha!

Anyhow, I might be wrong in all this, but my point is mostly that it wouldn't take a water cooled laser to burn some hair. Come visit me in Vancouver and we can test it out (on your beard).

Re: Laser Razor suspended by Kickstarter

#50

Post by meritt »

DannoHung wrote: post #40

The thing that is weird about this case is that one of the principals, Morgan Gustavsson, is actually the dude who invented the real laser hair removal that is used in clinics and has been involved in dermatology since. I don't know if he was actually involved in this project or not, but that was the one thing that made me think that this maybe wasn't 100% a scam? Anyway, the implication they make in their pitch isn'…

Or he's involved simply because he lends so much credibility to an otherwise obvious scam.
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