Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight • Hacker News Board

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#121

Post by ben_bai » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 1:55 PM UTC

Well, in german there is one word describing how to calculate something like this: "Leidensdruckanalyse".

It's a dark word, because it basically means: Why give people drugs for $13.50 if the disease is horrible enough that they will, in the long run, accept $750 to ease the pain or to not die.

We have laws preventing something like this, but then the industry just has to invent a "new" drug (basically the old one with a little difference in formula), sell it at a higher price and then discontinue the old drug.

Sad world, we live in.

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#122

Post by cptskippy » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 1:55 PM UTC

brixon wrote: post #15

JulianMorrison wrote: post #9

Drug creation needs to be nationalized, 100% tax funded all the way from researcher to trials to manufacture, and the drugs sold at cost thereafter. And the pharmaceuticals industry needs to just go away.

The drugs might end up being cheaper, but there will be much less research for drugs (aka less drugs in the future). Greed is a good motivator.

Unfortunately these greedy companies are sinking billions into erectile dysfunction drugs.

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#123

Post by elliottcarlson » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 1:57 PM UTC

fnordfnordfnord wrote: post #107

ck2 wrote: post #12

When I see "treating a life-threatening disease" and $750 a pill, formerly $14, I think people need long prison sentences to solve that. If we can put food processors who knowingly ship tainted food in prison in this country for endangering or even killing people, we can certainly imprison people for endangering lives by preventing the reception of medication.

We put a food processor who knowingly shipped tainted food in prison?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/20/us/peanut-butter-salmonella-tr...

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#124

Post by chinathrow » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 1:57 PM UTC

As someone with active Toxoplasmosis (yes, it's very rare) in my very close vicinity, I say to Martin: Fck you, you fcking scumbag.

His Twitter stream is also full of shitness these days. https://twitter.com/martinshkreli

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#125

Post by radmuzom » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 1:58 PM UTC

PedroBatista wrote: post #83

I'm really liking to see our resident Gourmet Libertarians either silent or trying a contortionist number on this one. ;) I mean, if the drug is that expensive just create another one and sell it half the price!! amiright?

Off-topic but related, any article which challenge libertarian principles seems to have suspiciously high number of comments as compared to upvotes on the article (as far as I am aware, HN drops off these articles from the front page quicker).

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#126

Post by huxley » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 2:00 PM UTC

mason240 wrote: post #99

JulianMorrison wrote: post #9

Drug creation needs to be nationalized, 100% tax funded all the way from researcher to trials to manufacture, and the drugs sold at cost thereafter. And the pharmaceuticals industry needs to just go away.

It's really shocking to such an anti-technological development comment on site about technological development. If the federal government had locked down all IT development in the 1980s as you proposing they do for pharmaceuticals, we wouldn't have this forum to comment on, much less the industry it is built around.

It's anti-corporate not anti-technological, not quite the same thing. After all the open and free Internet is the creation of government departments and government-funded universities.

I don't believe that anything as extreme as the parent suggests is necessary but I do believe that we should have enforceable transparency in the pharmaceuticals industry R&D costs and/or decoupling the drug trials system so that the trials have to be carried out by an independent third party.

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#127

Post by ctlby » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 2:01 PM UTC

JulianMorrison wrote: post #108

mason240 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's really shocking to such an anti-technological development comment on site about technological development. If the federal government had locked down all IT development in the 1980s as you proposing they do for pharmaceuticals, we wouldn't have this forum to comment on, much less the industry it is built around.

It really isn't comparable. Computers are tools. Drugs are health. They are a public good and a natural human right. Holding people's health hostage is unacceptable whether you do it with a knife in an alley, or a capitalist health system. Mixing them up like the USA system does is a category error.

Drugs are a complex good created through the intensive efforts of highly intelligent, trained human beings. They are anything but a natural right.

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#128

Post by twoodfin » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 2:03 PM UTC

ScottBev wrote: post #105

danmaz74 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what is preventing a different generics manufacturer to enter the market at that point? How long can an exploit like that go on?

The cost to setup a process and maintain it according to FDA requirements. The market size is likely just under the cost to establish the manufacturing capacity for the US market.

And yet the "bad guy" generic manufacturer was able to raise the capital to do this (and presumably make a profit). What's the difference?

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#129

Post by clavalle » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 2:04 PM UTC

jerf wrote: post #42

tammer wrote: post #27

I used to work for a generics manufacturer, and indeed this was their MO. Seek out old drugs that sill have a very viable market but are under the radar of the big guys, undersell until they're the only supplier left, then jack up the price when patients have no choice. It's despicable and seems inevitable with the current regulation model.

At least in the US, that actually sounds like it's already illegal from general business regulation. As in, no new laws needed, get the ones we have enforced. Wouldn't be surprised you can already pierce the corporate veil without new laws too. This is not specifically in reply to the parent, but the point fits here: I'd observe that calling for more regulation or even outright nationalization to fix this, when it's…

Perhaps not more, but faster and perhaps more thoroughly in order to change the player's risk assessment.

By the time these companies are called out they amass huge war chests and tie these things up in the courts for years while enriching their investors and management teams.

Then, when the hammer falls, that company disintegrates on some level and, often, these management teams spread to similar companies and do it all over again.

Obviously, something is not working. When something is not working the answer is almost never 'let's keep things the same and hope it turns out better.'

Re: Drug Goes from $13.50 a Tablet to $750, Overnight

#130

Post by clavalle » Mon, Sep 21, 2015, 2:06 PM UTC

if_by_whisky wrote: post #115

JulianMorrison wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really isn't comparable. Computers are tools. Drugs are health. They are a public good and a natural human right. Holding people's health hostage is unacceptable whether you do it with a knife in an alley, or a capitalist health system. Mixing them up like the USA system does is a category error.

Your solution would stop innovation in any industry

Because innovation cannot exist outside a purely market driven system?