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Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

ipfs.io

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Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#61

Post by _prometheus »

colordrops wrote: post #42
TheDong wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All you're doing then is fiddling with probabilities. You can do that just as well by changing the length of the sha unless you have a reason to think sha is broken. However, the probability of a hash collision is already incredibly low. As a demonstration of this, here's a list of a tiny subset of bitcoin private keys: http://directory.io/ The human mind just isn't capable of understanding how large of a number the…

But the probability that sha256 is broken is much much higher than a collision, and definitely within the realm of human understanding.

this is why we use multihash -- https://github.com/jbenet/multihash

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#62

Post by _prometheus »

whyrusleeping wrote: post #48
gtrubetskoy wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well.... while an asteroid annihilating life on the planet isn't likely, the size of the web isn't a joke either, so such a collision is more probable than in other cases... I suppose this could be made a problem for the user, i.e. if you want to make sure that your page isn't colliding with any other, then simply check first. (Of course there is still a race condition possibility of two colliding addresses being cre…

Heres the article i normally link to when this comes up: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4014090/is-it-safe-to-ign... Its generally considered safe to ignore, there are no known sha256 collisions, and most people are fairly confident they wont see one for quite some time.

the caveat of course being that SHA256 may be _broken_. That's when we'd have to upgrade to another hash function.

(We may improve how this upgrade will work down the road by allowing links to link with multiple hashes at the same time, but at this time this has not proved to be necessary, and can be added later)

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#63

Post by _prometheus »

viraptor wrote: post #49

I was running IPFS as "my own pastebin for files" for a while (it's great!), but was wondering what can they do to improve adoption / popularity. This move is amazing! Useful, interesting for people who care, and visible for others. Next, I'd really like someone to implement git backend in IPFS / IPNS. Right now there's https://github.com/whyrusleeping/git-ipfs-rehost but that's just simple hosting.

see also: https://github.com/cryptix/git-remote-ipfs

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#64

Post by dperfect »

_prometheus wrote: post #60
dperfect wrote: post #59

I wish this article mentioned something about BitSwap; before reading the IPFS paper, I was doubtful about anyone wanting to participate without incentives. Still, even after skimming the paper, it sounds like a lot really depends on how well BitSwap is implemented. At one point, the paper says this: > While the notion of a barter system implies a virtual currency could be created, this would require a global ledger…

Check out another protocol we (the IPFS creators) are working on: http://filecoin.io

Interesting - I'll have to check it out. Thanks for pointing me to this.

Really cool stuff by the way - I'm very excited to see people working on this, and I hope IPFS (or something like it) is successful.

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#65

Post by PhaseMage »

I absolutely love the concept and the underlying moral reasoning for why we need IPFS!

One of the first questions that came to me: Is there any way to add a forward error correcting code, like an erasure code to IPFS? I didn't find any discussion of this in the IPFS paper.

This seems somewhat critical to be able to compete with modern centralized storage systems which are likely to use FEC extensively to provide the level of redundancy that customers expect. Modern FEC codes can provide phenomenal levels of redundancy with less than 50% overhead. IPFS seems to rely on many fully-redundant copies?

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#66

Post by viraptor »

_prometheus wrote: post #63
viraptor wrote: post #49

I was running IPFS as "my own pastebin for files" for a while (it's great!), but was wondering what can they do to improve adoption / popularity. This move is amazing! Useful, interesting for people who care, and visible for others. Next, I'd really like someone to implement git backend in IPFS / IPNS. Right now there's https://github.com/whyrusleeping/git-ipfs-rehost but that's just simple hosting.

see also: https://github.com/cryptix/git-remote-ipfs

I love the person who made it. It's exactly what I needed.

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#67

Post by radlad »

Rhapso wrote: post #54
radlad wrote: post #14

I'm very excited to see what happens with IPFS. The article talks about replacing HTTP however, and this is definitely a tricky task. Someone in this thread already asked one of my questions (So is this primarily for static websites?) but my second question is: So is this primarily for personal websites? I'm having a hard time finding a good way for Facebook, for example, to monetize their website. Targeting ads go o…

You can free space, but how that happens is not explicit. The more people a file is requested by, the more places it is stored. If the file ceases to be requested, and all the participants decide to remove it from their caches, the file is gone. DHT records are slightly more persistent, but without a sponsor they fade as the network's churn removes the nodes that once hosted them. It is very hard to delete things, an…

Hmm, that was sort of what I figured, but that seems to me as though calling it a "permanent" web is a bit of a misnomer. There is still a place for projects like the Internet Archive.

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#68

Post by lewisl9029 »

So let's say I'm building a decentralized chat app built on some DHT and would like to host it on IPFS.

I imagine getting the static html/js/css for the client-side app onto IPFS should be simple enough, but how would I handle bootstrapping?

Even in a decentralized service, clients need to connect to a seed server somewhere to start querying for other peers on the DHT. Would it be possible to host such a seed server on IPFS? Or would the seed server still need to live on a traditional server somewhere on the "old web"?

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#69

Post by whyrusleeping »

lewisl9029 wrote: post #68

So let's say I'm building a decentralized chat app built on some DHT and would like to host it on IPFS. I imagine getting the static html/js/css for the client-side app onto IPFS should be simple enough, but how would I handle bootstrapping? Even in a decentralized service, clients need to connect to a seed server somewhere to start querying for other peers on the DHT. Would it be possible to host such a seed server…

The way our network currently bootstraps is to dial a set of peers that are hardcoded into the default config file. We also have mdns for finding peers that are on your LAN without the need for any hard coded addresses.

Re: Neocities is implementing IPFS – distributed, permanent web

#70

Post by lallysingh »

_prometheus wrote: post #20
jeswin wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree. What we really need is for browser vendors to get together, bring in the tremendous financial and technical resources they have, and get a decentralized protocol formalized and supported across browsers. It may take years, but it needs to be done. That would change the internet, and the world.

Two pieces of (coming soon) good news: - very soon, you wont need to install anything to use IPFS. it will "just work" with js on today's browsers. - for best perf, yes, we need browser implementations. and... those have begun :)

Are those implementations extensions or do they require native code changes?
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