Live data from Hacker News

Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

math.uwaterloo.ca

21–30 of 64 posts

Re: Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

#21
post #6
post #2

Does anyone have links to audio samples where these differences are prominent? In addition to comments, this video has a decent comparison using sawtooth tones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRlp-OH0OEA

I went looking. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBt6APk21tU

Hearing Chopin in Meantone is pretty awesome.

Re: Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

#24
post #2

Does anyone have links to audio samples where these differences are prominent? In addition to comments, this video has a decent comparison using sawtooth tones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRlp-OH0OEA

Wouldn't that be nice, rather than whining about numbers? It's an informative article, but the reality is that nobody cares . And I mean "nobody" in the approximate sense of 99.9% of music listeners. The reality is that our brains are more than happy to glue these nasty thirds to their hypothetical frequencies. Sure, they have a little roughness to them, but it's not a big deal, especially considering that most piano…

It's probably true that 99.9% of music listeners don't know, don't care, and can't tell the difference. But a few of us care a lot, and it's sometimes very important. I've been recently obsessed with barbershop quartet music, where the tuning of chords is absolutely pivotal. The alignment of overtones from justly tuned chords is, if you ask me, the entire point of the genre. The "ringing" produced from the aligned overtones is, I would guess, noticeable to a large portion of people with rudimentary music education.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbershop_music#Ringing_cho...

Two examples of fairly audible ringing (probably start a little before my timestamps to get a little context):

http://youtu.be/KpBRetTqnqQ at 3:07

http://youtu.be/z9L4QEptVRo at 4:23

Re: Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

#25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't that be nice, rather than whining about numbers? It's an informative article, but the reality is that nobody cares . And I mean "nobody" in the approximate sense of 99.9% of music listeners. The reality is that our brains are more than happy to glue these nasty thirds to their hypothetical frequencies. Sure, they have a little roughness to them, but it's not a big deal, especially considering that most piano…

To make matters worse, or maybe better, most non keyboard instruments have no sensible temperament whatsoever. Even fretted instruments are a compromise.

Most non keyboard instruments have ways to adjust the pitch slightly per interval while playing, allowing experienced players to play all intervals perfectly.

Re: Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

#26
post #15

There is some debate as to whether Bach intended equal-temperament or well-temperament. These terms were not well-defined in his day. https://books.google.com/books?id=yZ95L8Xohs0C&pg=PA4

There's one guy on youtube who claims Bach's squiggles underneath each piece title in the original WTC manuscript actually represents an ideal tuning system for that piece.

I thought that was a crackpot theory, but then he played some pieces in their respective individual tuning systems on a harpsichord, and they sounded absolutely amazing, better than well tempered (or equal obviously). So who knows!

Re: Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

#28
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went looking. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBt6APk21tU

Thank you. That is astounding. I wonder if there is any way to find music performed using original tunings. It sounds SO much better to me.

You can listen to barbershop music if you want to hear justly tuned chords. Just don't get too obsessed with it unless you want equal-tempered music (i.e. almost all recorded music) to sound just a bit wrong. YouTube videos are hard to come by, but I posted two examples in this thread:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10145785

And another clip I uploaded of using pitch-detecting software on a studio recording (notice it detects a lot more than 4 simultaneous notes, because it's "hearing" overtones):

http://youtu.be/v7kHnEaGIfg

Re: Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

#29
post #2

Does anyone have links to audio samples where these differences are prominent? In addition to comments, this video has a decent comparison using sawtooth tones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRlp-OH0OEA

Wouldn't that be nice, rather than whining about numbers? It's an informative article, but the reality is that nobody cares . And I mean "nobody" in the approximate sense of 99.9% of music listeners. The reality is that our brains are more than happy to glue these nasty thirds to their hypothetical frequencies. Sure, they have a little roughness to them, but it's not a big deal, especially considering that most piano…

    in the approximate sense of 99.9% of music listeners.
The best thing about the Internet is that connects the other .1% that actually care, and the rest of humanity that has no appreciation of good music can ignore it. And really, the great composers of the future will be part of that tiny minority.

Seriously though, it would be amazing to have mainstream acceptance and performance of classical works in their intended tunings. That would be cool. Half the stuff just doesn't sound right in equal temperament.

Re: Well vs. Equal Temperament (2000)

#30
post #11
post #2

Does anyone have links to audio samples where these differences are prominent? In addition to comments, this video has a decent comparison using sawtooth tones: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRlp-OH0OEA

Wendy Carlos released a 2nd version of her Bach Brandenberg Concertos that were done using period tuning on synthesizers including modulations. perhaps you can compare the two.

Do you mean "Switched-On Brandenburgs: The Complete Concertos Vol. 1"?
Post reply on HN