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Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

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Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#201

Post by flinty »

dublinclontarf wrote: post #160
tomp wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously not, when it comes to sex. Men pay for sex, women get paid for sex. That's all you need to know about the demand and supply dynamics in the sexual "market" (which Tinder embodies).

> Men pay for sex, women get paid for sex Some.

Payment isn't necessarily in cash. You pay with your time, commitment, interest, attention. If there is literally anything else you could be potentially doing but are spending time with a girl with the hope of getting sex out of it then you are paying for it.

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#202

Post by angersock »

normloman wrote: post #198
angersock wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, for the first part, it follows pretty directly from basic logic: Assume women are looking for mates (reasonable). Assume women will more favorably choose a mate the farther they are above some arbitrary standard (reasonable, though at the extreme end we see falloff--"I don't deserve him, he'd never date me, etc."--sames as we do in the other direction). Assume that these standards are the result of exposure to lo…

Inaccurate assumption #1: There was a time when all men wanted traditional relationships. Inaccurate assumption #2: That all women rejected these traditional arrangements. Inaccurate assumption #3: That all women are now regretting the outcome of their collective actions. Reality: Women made individual choices as to which relationships they wanted to pursue. And being rejected by a woman still doesn't give you the ri…

Several women in the article certainly seem to be regretting the outcome of their collective actions:

"“It’s a contest to see who cares less, and guys win a lot at caring less,” Amanda says."

"“No, like 90 percent,” said Ashley (the same as mentioned earlier). “I’m hoping to find the 10 percent somewhere. But every boy I’ve ever met is a fuckboy.”"

As for the rest...you keep wanting to insert the "all" qualifier into things as though that is some kind of legitimate critique. The use of "women" instead of "all women" is intentional, as it denotes a sort of large number instead of universality.

If I'd said "all women", "all men", etc., I would agree with your critique--but I didn't.

You're basically talking past my observations. Your inaccurate assumptions are not those that I used anywhere in my reasoning, least of all because of your insistence on prepending "all" in front of everything.

And being rejected by a woman still doesn't give you the right to be an asshole.

On Hacker News we do tend to shy away from namecalling. :)

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#203

Post by flinty »

jazzyk wrote: post #191
rndn wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Citation needed. This is still very new research, but not implausible. See for example section 3.6 in this paper [1]. > By contrast, there are a lot of cultures (eg. India, the Arab/Muslim world) where marriage is societally more or less obligatory. An interpretation of that could be that it’s a result of memetics [2], i.e. several successful cultures have invented marriage because it makes them successful. Marriag…

The theory you brought makes no sense for two reasons: 1. If all women mated with the same small group of genetically-gifted men, there would be much less gene-mixing and variation in their offspring. Not good for evolution. 2. Monogamy was invented because it takes a lot of time/effort to bring up human offspring (typically 18-21 years :-)). Mothers need a guarantee that fathers will be around to provide for the chi…

http://arstechnica.com/science/2015/03/neolithic-culture-may...

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#204

Post by grehce »

fezz wrote: post #144
pavlov wrote: post #3

But others lament the way the extreme casualness of sex in the age of Tinder leaves many women feeling de-valued. “It’s rare for a woman of our generation to meet a man who treats her like a priority instead of an option,” wrote Erica Gordon on the Gen Y Web site Elite Daily, in 2014. If a woman doesn't want to feel like an option, shouldn't she stay far away from Tinder? It's not like there isn't a million other way…

"The next best thing" You're either someone's option right now until the next better option comes along or you yourself are doing that to someone else. Tinder amplifies being "next best". You're never "the best" option and the best option for you becomes elusive. It's the uncanny valley of dating.

Sadly, I don't believe it is really about the "Next Best Thing" as much as it is about a reluctance for struggle. Real relationships take work and the newness in dating doesn't allow some of our uglier, vulnerable traits to surface.

We opt for convenience over depth because investment in another person requires acknowledging the risk of a temporal imbalance in the relationship that most people today are extremely uncomfortable with -- to a point, where I believe some choose polyamorous relationships over monogamous ones because there is a perception of de-risking loss.

Hopefully, Tinder will be a fad because even the most beautiful will age and by then maybe aspire for something more meaningful as the tedium of "dating" wears.

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#205

Post by johnny22 »

anon3_ wrote: post #124
Yhippa wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been thinking about why Tinder seems like a bad deal for my lady friends. It seems that women used to hold the power in online dating but for whatever reason Tinder has turned into a site that reduces the cost (time investment and biological risk) to sleep with strangers. It seems that as that's picked up the new norm is a "race to the bottom" for women who want traditional relationships.

> It seems that as that's picked up the new norm is a "race to the bottom" for women who want traditional relationships. This is so backwards. Women use tinder to get attention, not relationships. Rarely sex. Men are the one's in the race to the bottom. They get ignored by all of them. The women use it to treat men like ants. Yet these studies and willing betas still treat women like the victims. As men, the larger i…

Seems like you're projecting. Finding amazing women (as a cis hetorosexual) has never been easier. ATM it's more like the paradox of choice.

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#206

Post by beachstartup »

akshat_h wrote: post #173
_sh wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The guy at my Uni would stand stand at the door when they closed the Uni bar every Friday night and proposition every girl as they filed out the door. Every one. Never failed to score. He had no standards, but was amazing to watch. He was Danish, we called it the 'Scando Sweep'.

Did he actually bluntly ask "Will you have sex with me?".

this actually works. i've gotten laid this way. women are human, they want to get drunk and fuck.

if you don't believe it, it's probably because you've been raised/brainwashed with false beliefs about women and have a set of skewed expectations.

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#207

Post by beachstartup »

frame_perfect wrote: post #41
meatysnapper wrote: post #7

God I wish I was in NYC. The stories I've heard from buddies there! West coast scene is not like this at all, especially not in Man-Francisco or Man-Jose (unless you like men of course).

Seriously. I flew out to NYC for a job interview. Was there for just 2 days and I got laid. I wasn't even trying at all, I was just there for an interview! And this was after a 2.5 year dry streak in SF. My god I want to go back.

san francisco is absolutely miserable when it comes to dating. it's the only place in the world (the WORLD) i've been insulted to my face for trying to talk to women when out at night. i spent my early 20s there and i regret it immensely. i think it stunted me. no shit.

now i live in LA, which is fine but not stellar in this area.

new york is basically paradise for young single men. it's next-level.

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#208

Post by nodemaker »

angersock wrote: post #197
normloman wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"and so many women (the historical gatekeepers of sex and relationships, fair or not) began to hold out on local suitors because they didn't meet some platonic ideal they'd seen once somewhere." Citation needed. Pretty sure women had standards before television and movies. "If they'd wanted traditional relationships, they should've been friendlier and less aloof when they were being courted earlier." Ah, the 'nice gu…

So, for the first part, it follows pretty directly from basic logic: Assume women are looking for mates (reasonable). Assume women will more favorably choose a mate the farther they are above some arbitrary standard (reasonable, though at the extreme end we see falloff--"I don't deserve him, he'd never date me, etc."--sames as we do in the other direction). Assume that these standards are the result of exposure to lo…

I do agree with you on a few points (like the sum total of unhappiness has increased) but man you do need to go out and meet some women who break your stereotypes. Everytime I make any stereotype I am really eager to find someone who breaks them and with women its really very easy because for every bitchy girl I meet, I also meet at least three girls who are super nice! You just have to keep going till you meet them.

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#209

Post by anon3_ »

johnny22 wrote: post #205
anon3_ wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems that as that's picked up the new norm is a "race to the bottom" for women who want traditional relationships. This is so backwards. Women use tinder to get attention, not relationships. Rarely sex. Men are the one's in the race to the bottom. They get ignored by all of them. The women use it to treat men like ants. Yet these studies and willing betas still treat women like the victims. As men, the larger i…

Seems like you're projecting. Finding amazing women (as a cis hetorosexual) has never been easier. ATM it's more like the paradox of choice.

(Disclaimer: I used to work at a dating website.)

You have it backwards. A paradox of choice for females.

Men aren't picking, they're the one's pasting messages desperately to get responses. It's a hopeless situation.

Ever been to a night club? Male:Female ratio? You have any idea how much worse it is on a dating website?

It's interesting how you say I projected, I'm interested in the tendency of men to fib about their success with females.

Yes, I've seen hundreds of comments like yours, then I saw their accounts get banned out of frustration the next day.

Even if you did have success on a dating website (I have, and have had friends who married), by no means are they in favor of men.

If you need me to elaborate on the data, I can.

Re: Tinder and the Dawn of the “Dating Apocalypse”

#210

Post by tripzilch »

xeromal wrote: post #110
fredkbloggs wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only barriers to entry are having a smartphone and being able to push a couple buttons and swipe. That's not creating an environment that's even remotely exclusive, and there's zero reason to believe the few people who are excluded by it are more likely than others to have an STI. And vetting them how, anyway? You might be able to find out whether someone is a felon, but I have no idea how I would (legally) find…

It buys you time. I think that's what the OP was saying. You can stare at a match for as long as you want. In a bar, the deal expires rather quickly.

But you can't tell if someone has an STD by staring/looking at them, either.
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