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Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

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Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#151

Im in Germany, i can see no investment to grow a european google. Oh, yes there are great declarations of grandios plans. But my experience in a baker-shop can tell you everything on the european attitude towards technology. "So what are you doing for a livin?" "I work as a software developer.." "Oh, so your company doesent produce anything real?" You cant force a culture to embrace something new that it detests. Thi…

> "Oh, so your company doesent produce anything real?"

The euros are real

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#152
post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Protectionism and xenophobia are different things.

Can you explain any of your answers? If it was protectionism why was the US the only country listed?

Because the US is the only country that is relevant in this context. None of the major software or web services in use in Europe come from Russia or Nigeria or Australia so there is nothing for trade protections to protect against.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, the clashes of European companies with EU regulators just don't create as much press. The most recent anti-trust/cartel activity is listed by the European Commission for Competition: http://ec.europa.eu/competition/elojade/isef/index.cfm?fusea... http://ec.europa.eu/competition/cartels/cases/cases.html Currently that covers: something about pay-TV in UK/Ireland, Qualcomm, a bunch of European cargo t…

They're trying hard to make me believe you too. But please note that it's not just anti-trust cases, but also privacy cases / right to be forgotten / partnerships with newspapers / etc... When the NSA scandal was everywhere in the press, Orange (french telecom operator, former public company) said there was no need for the french administration to spy on them because they were already cooperating outside the judiciar…

You may have noticed that the US media was comparably silent about US agencies. German media is relatively silent on German involvement (but reported on the US and France).

That's just what the media needs to do to keep getting interviews with high ranking politicians.

I doubt that the approach is to try to hurt the US, but to limit the impact on domestic relations to public officials.

As for Facebook, that's one of the things that users _can_ do something about (however little the impact of such action is). If there were a French Facebook, the same could apply there as well - but besides Daily Motion (which is public by default), what is there in France where people could adapt their behavior?

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, countries have generally decided you can't copyright factual information, and they did that for a reason.

In the EU, it is illegal to copy a database of another entity even if it contains factual information (you can copy individual facts, but not a DB). Source: I realized that when I wondered if it was possible to copy names from Wikipedia into OpenStreetmap. The Wikimedia foundation ("owner" of the DB) is unlikely to sue OSM.

Wikipedia data is available under a choice of open licenses: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reusing_Wikipedia_co... They're unlikely to sue because 1. They don't want to, making information freely available is kinda their thing, and 2. They'd lose.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#155
post #3

If you look at what has happened in China after Google left, how they were able to quickly grow massive web companies, protectionism seems like a no-brainer for every slightly advanced country. Silicon Valley sees the huge first-mover advantages and is moving as fast as possible to move into every liberalized market. But it makes no sense for a country to allow Silicon Valley to take these industries for themselves.…

China already had massive web companies before Google entered the market - including Baidu. China's move wasn't so much protectionism as it was censorship.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#156
post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain any of your answers? If it was protectionism why was the US the only country listed?

Because the US is the only country that is relevant in this context. None of the major software or web services in use in Europe come from Russia or Nigeria or Australia so there is nothing for trade protections to protect against.

[deleted]

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#157

> “Dominant companies can’t abuse their dominant position to create advantage in related markets,” she said bluntly, formally accusing Google of exploiting its supremacy in general search to dominate the market for online product searches It seems completely ridiculous to call those two different markets. Finding the most relevant X on the web is fundamentally part of the same market no matter what X is. Now, if they…

* Finding the most relevant X on the web is fundamentally part of the same market no matter what X is.*

The thing is, if what Google displays as "the most relevant X" is always or predominantly or even merely often a Google site, rather than what is actually the most relevant X, then Google is abusing their dominant position to create advantage in related markets. I do agree that the failed 2014 deal was a piece of crap.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Free trade unfortunately also leads to what is called a "branch plant economy" where policy decisions are made by foreigners with much less interest in your national or regional success. Trade makes everyone better off, in general, but is risky, because policies can change. Free trade in particular gets even riskier as it means the populace has fewer levers of influence against the corporations. Canada is experiencin…

How many Europeans use Google? 90%. That's democracy: the people of Europe gets what it wants. When Europe says "we'll fix what's wrong with Google", do they want to convert the last 10%? If not, then it has nothing to do with the people. You think democracy is what protects people against companies? How strange. If there's no demand for a lousy french dropbox-like service, and people use Dropbox instead, it's becaus…

No, that’s the thing: A lot of european small companies don’t care much about growth. That’s the exact thing.

And this mindset of "it works well enough" now meets with the US mindset of wasting resources, of eternal, aggressive growth, of pure capitalism.

Obviously, that doesn't work well.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#159

> “Dominant companies can’t abuse their dominant position to create advantage in related markets,” she said bluntly, formally accusing Google of exploiting its supremacy in general search to dominate the market for online product searches It seems completely ridiculous to call those two different markets. Finding the most relevant X on the web is fundamentally part of the same market no matter what X is. Now, if they…

* Finding the most relevant X on the web is fundamentally part of the same market no matter what X is.* The thing is, if what Google displays as "the most relevant X" is always or predominantly or even merely often a Google site, rather than what is actually the most relevant X, then Google is abusing their dominant position to create advantage in related markets . I do agree that the failed 2014 deal was a piece of…

Right. And when someone is searching for facts, Google is using their dominant position to just display the facts, instead of just a link to a web site that has the facts.

The problem is the definition of what are 'facts'. Are birthdates? Are consumer good prices? Are classified postings? Airline flight times?

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#160
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you greatly underestimate how many jobs are dependent on our auto industry. It is not only the cars, big companies like Bosch and a plethora of hidden champions, that dominate their segment but nobody recognizes, would not be possible if it were not for the close connection at home to a world-wide leading industry. I am not even sure, that Silicon Valley is ahead when it comes to "digital stuff" inside cars.…

Yeah, sure. You mean besides the extreme bureaucracy, poor funding opportunities, poor exit opportunities. Germany is probably one of the WORST places for a start-up.

>extreme bureaucracy

As someone doing business in Germany since the age of 17, I would actually like to know, what you mean by that. Of course employment works different here (like generally in Europe), and I also give you that it is much harder for non-Germans, but if you know the language you can generally just call the folks at our IRS and they are happy to help you.

Starting to freelance is literally just filling out a one page online form at the Gewerbeamt, after that do not call them, they call you.

Setting up an entity is a bid harder, but come on, registering an UG or a LTD (in the UK, this is Europe after all, you can register your company pretty much where you want to) is not black magic either. It could be easier, but I do not buy that we are missing opportunities, because you have to google it first.

> poor funding opportunities, poor exit opportunities.

>Germany is probably one of the WORST places for a start-up.

I give you lacking funding opportunity, but the notion seems to be, that early stage funding is pretty okay, mid and later stage rounds seem to be the problem. We do have an exchange in Frankfurt and car companies are buying startups in their space, the problem is more, that there simply are not that many of them.

There is also the possibility to join Rocket, their E-commerce and (locale) marketplaces seem to do just fine, funding-wise.

I think we are pretty okay, even without the short-lived social stuff, that SV creates, which some people call a scheme anyway. What I would like to see more of are SaaS products in many different spaces. I do not think that missing funding or a bureaucracy are the reasons why we do not have more of them. I think the reasons are rooted deeper in society, which is slowly changing over time, thanks David Fincher.

Also: Compared to what? SV or the 192 other countries that exists besides Germany and America?

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