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Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

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121–130 of 187 posts

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#121
post #33

>Although she uses Google frequently, Vestager says it doesn’t cloud her view of the case. “Congratulations for being big, but don’t misuse it. For Europeans, this is very fundamental,” she says. >That might be the scariest thing of all for Google. It isn’t dealing with an antitech ideologue or a competition czar consumed with cementing a personal legacy. It faces a straightforward prosecutor in a hostile political c…

So Vestager is a straightforward politician that is actually doing her job and has no other agenda than supporting local businesses and protecting the interests of the consumer?

This is fantastic. I wish we had some more people of her caliber in US politics. Reflects well on the EU that she was elected.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#122
post #116

Im in Germany, i can see no investment to grow a european google. Oh, yes there are great declarations of grandios plans. But my experience in a baker-shop can tell you everything on the european attitude towards technology. "So what are you doing for a livin?" "I work as a software developer.." "Oh, so your company doesent produce anything real?" You cant force a culture to embrace something new that it detests. Thi…

Please don't speak of a "European attitude towards technology" when there is none. For example, I can't imagine hearing the attitude you describe here in Sweden, and I believe you could find plenty of germans who would disagree with you as well. Not only are we many different countries, but we are also different individuals. There is no common "European attitude towards technology".

This is a very reasonable point. By the same logic, there should not be a single European action taken against Google either. The people behind all of the political resistance to Google in EU countries seem to all be from, or tied to, EU corporations who want to take some of the market from Google by force. They are trying to push through regulations that are good for their company with little regard to what is good for the people of all the different EU nations.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Scrapped the data most likely

Well, countries have generally decided you can't copyright factual information, and they did that for a reason.

In the EU, it is illegal to copy a database of another entity even if it contains factual information (you can copy individual facts, but not a DB). Source: I realized that when I wondered if it was possible to copy names from Wikipedia into OpenStreetmap. The Wikimedia foundation ("owner" of the DB) is unlikely to sue OSM.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#124

For a long time, countries agreed that free-trade was the best way to avoid another war. Europe was created as an economic region first, to avoid another war. But today I'm afraid Europe suffers memory loss. They're using coercion against another country (always the same one, the USA) for ideological reasons... which is the very definition of war. The fact they're citing money as the reason only makes it more frighte…

Free trade unfortunately also leads to what is called a "branch plant economy" where policy decisions are made by foreigners with much less interest in your national or regional success.

Trade makes everyone better off, in general, but is risky, because policies can change. Free trade in particular gets even riskier as it means the populace has fewer levers of influence against the corporations. Canada is experiencing this with auto manufacturers - many Japanese and American (some German) companies build cars in Canada and Mexico for the broader North American market because of North American free trade and lower labour costs in both countries (the exchange rate, single payer health care in Canada, more reasonable unions, etc). But now so many jobs depend on these companies, the Regional Governments can't let them leave in economic downturns. So they subsidize. Is this all a net positive? Probably, but it's hard to know.

When you accept the upside of trade you need to accept the downsides - but most don't. "Let the free market choose" isn't an answer because we live in a Democracy, one feature of which is to prevent the market from getting what it wants when the people don't like it.

The USA dominates technology with only a few counter-examples in Europe (SAP, Amadeus, ASOS) - but LOTS in China. If the future is going to be these companies diversifying into every other market ("software is eating the world") you can bet there's justifiable anger at the U.S. (At beating them in a new area of knowledge and practice) and a desire to put up barriers while they get their shit together as China did.

This isn't war, it's competition. There's a big difference.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#125

For a long time, countries agreed that free-trade was the best way to avoid another war. Europe was created as an economic region first, to avoid another war. But today I'm afraid Europe suffers memory loss. They're using coercion against another country (always the same one, the USA) for ideological reasons... which is the very definition of war. The fact they're citing money as the reason only makes it more frighte…

There are plenty of reasons anti-American sentiment is growing in Europe and it goes much, much further than a few tech companies.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#126
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No Americans are forcing you to use our services. If you have a problem then don't use them it's that simple. You're able to boycott anything on the Internet. I'm tired of Anti-American sentiment when your governments are in bed with ours. American companies weren't the only ones sharing data. German and Belgium telecoms were in bed with spy agencies and not just with the Five Eyes. In public Merkle was outraged but…

I don't see any anti-American sentiment in the OP's message. He's just making an economic argument that may or may not be correct.

>kick out the Americans!

Anytime someone wants to kick me out I take offense. He's talking about kicking out all American companies and making their own tools as a replacement. How is that not Anti-American?

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#127
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see any anti-American sentiment in the OP's message. He's just making an economic argument that may or may not be correct.

>kick out the Americans! Anytime someone wants to kick me out I take offense. He's talking about kicking out all American companies and making their own tools as a replacement. How is that not Anti-American?

Protectionism and xenophobia are different things.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#128
post #113

For a long time, countries agreed that free-trade was the best way to avoid another war. Europe was created as an economic region first, to avoid another war. But today I'm afraid Europe suffers memory loss. They're using coercion against another country (always the same one, the USA) for ideological reasons... which is the very definition of war. The fact they're citing money as the reason only makes it more frighte…

Considering they are not using any violence, I think this falls a bit short of the very definition of war.

Coercion is most often the perspective of violence. Why would Google pay fines then? Because violence will be applied to make it comply even if it's a foreign entity.

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#129
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>kick out the Americans! Anytime someone wants to kick me out I take offense. He's talking about kicking out all American companies and making their own tools as a replacement. How is that not Anti-American?

Protectionism and xenophobia are different things.

Can you explain any of your answers? If it was protectionism why was the US the only country listed?

Re: Google’s $6B Miscalculation on the EU

#130
post #99
post #3

If you look at what has happened in China after Google left, how they were able to quickly grow massive web companies, protectionism seems like a no-brainer for every slightly advanced country. Silicon Valley sees the huge first-mover advantages and is moving as fast as possible to move into every liberalized market. But it makes no sense for a country to allow Silicon Valley to take these industries for themselves.…

No Americans are forcing you to use our services. If you have a problem then don't use them it's that simple. You're able to boycott anything on the Internet. I'm tired of Anti-American sentiment when your governments are in bed with ours. American companies weren't the only ones sharing data. German and Belgium telecoms were in bed with spy agencies and not just with the Five Eyes. In public Merkle was outraged but…

The majority of the problem is about the US and the NSA.
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