Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#1

Post by blats » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 5:23 PM UTC

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Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#2

Post by erdos2 » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 7:09 PM UTC

Here's a detailed link on setting up a scheme server (perhaps more detailed than many system admins would need). I'd err towards mod_lisp under Apache rather than run SISC Scheme under Tomcat, but this is a pleasant read: http://www.lisperati.com/quick.html

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#3

Post by dhouston » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 7:37 PM UTC

if you're thinking of developing a web app in lisp but haven't looked at python or ruby, you might consider them -- remember, it's not just the raw language but also the surrounding infrastructure, and python (django, turbogears) and ruby (rails) have arguably much more developed frameworks, and also arguably have most of the interesting language features that would draw you to lisp in the first place.

the point is the language is only one piece of the equation -- you want to be spending your time developing your app, not rolling your own supporting elements (templating systems, init scripts, form validators, sql bindings/mappers, etc.) and of course i'm sure others will point out reddit's switch from lisp to python.

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#4

Post by dpapathanasiou » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 7:39 PM UTC

Here's an overview of different approaches: http://bc.tech.coop/blog/041017.html

And here's a list of different web server resources: http://www.cl-user.net/asp/tags/web-servers

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#5

Post by gibsonf1 » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 7:50 PM UTC

erdos2 wrote: post #2

Here's a detailed link on setting up a scheme server (perhaps more detailed than many system admins would need). I'd err towards mod_lisp under Apache rather than run SISC Scheme under Tomcat, but this is a pleasant read: http://www.lisperati.com/quick.html

Why did you decide to go with Scheme as opposed to Lisp? (I'm very curious about the pros and cons)

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#6

Post by brlewis » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 7:54 PM UTC

Sorry, I spent years demonstrating to people how Lisp is better for everybody doing web development, not just elite programmers. I'm done. My new philosophy is, if you can't get them to join you, beat them.

Now I'm at a point where my venture absolutely must succeed. I'll take every advantage I can get.

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#7

Post by jkush » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 7:58 PM UTC

There's also this resource which is very much for beginners but if you're just starting to find out all about using Lisp to do web development this might be a good read:

http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/practical-web-programming-with-allegroserve.html

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#8

Post by jkush » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 8:02 PM UTC

jkush wrote: post #7

There's also this resource which is very much for beginners but if you're just starting to find out all about using Lisp to do web development this might be a good read: http://www.gigamonkeys.com/book/practical-web-programming-with-allegroserve.html

Please pardon how newbieish this article starts out. I don't mean to insinuate that you're at this level - I was just dropping a link that may or not may be of use to you.

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#9

Post by vikram » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 8:07 PM UTC

I'd use a continuation based framework to get started. Seaside for smalltalk, plt-scheme or UCW in lisp. I've been using UCW to develop my project. It makes it really easy to think about the problem. You serve a page, the page has actions (method calls) which take parameters. The parameters are fields on the page. It's really easy to think about an application. It lets you prototype in code.

For our stuff, I started with rails, just found it too hard to get started. I had to decide what the tables looked like, how I was going to divide the data, write a model for every table then connect it to a page.

With UCW, I write code which connects to a function call. Simple.

Re: Lisp for web apps? Tell me more.. (seriously)

#10

Post by vikram » Mon, Apr 09, 2007, 8:08 PM UTC

dhouston wrote: post #3

if you're thinking of developing a web app in lisp but haven't looked at python or ruby, you might consider them -- remember, it's not just the raw language but also the surrounding infrastructure, and python (django, turbogears) and ruby (rails) have arguably much more developed frameworks, and also arguably have most of the interesting language features that would draw you to lisp in the first place. the point is t…

Most people say that you shouldn't use lisp because it doesn't have libraries. Well they are only half right. You shouldn't use lisp, because most lisp libraries have very little documentation. Lisp has a lot of libraries. You have to be willing to read code (i.e. examples/tests) to figure out how to use them.

http://www.cliki.net/Library

Assuming that the most precious commodity is development time. I'd say rails/django don't even come close to UCW in getting stuff done.