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EFF is leaving X

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Re: EFF is leaving X

#981

Post by bifrost »

butterNaN wrote: post #910
bifrost wrote: post #851

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was over for me when the EFF advanced the charge of government censorship of the internet. The EFF had previously been a client of mine so I was somewhat familiar with how things worked and basically once Gilmore was out, it went downhill. They did a lot of good work (much like the ACLU) but they are now honestly unrecognizable. My old company donated around $3k/mo of services for almost a decade which in the gran…

> when the EFF advanced the charge of government censorship of the internet Wait, when did this happen? What are you referring to here?

When they supported the legislation called "Net Neutrality" which attempted to supplant the concept of actual net neutrality with some quasi government control of the internet. It would've enabled massive censorship on the internet, something that we've seen is a very very bad thing.

Re: EFF is leaving X

#982

Post by bifrost »

schoen wrote: post #572
contagiousflow wrote: post #529

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I remember hearing the phrase "that's not an EFF issue" spoken much more frequently in the earlier part of my time at the organization. I'm not saying that isn't a valid critique, but from 2001 to 2019 so much more of out culture, politics, and protest have shifted to online spaces (for better or worse). Do you think that the EFF just has _more_ to do now because of the shifting needs of our online spaces and the i…

I mentioned that interpretation very briefly in my post. If EFF had continued to be better at political neutrality, I'm sure many observers would have been surprised at times that it declined to take positions on some of the hot issues of the day. That hypothetical reticence could have been interpreted as cowardice or irrelevance, or as saving up political capital to really focus on a smaller number of more fundament…

Age verification is a great example. We've seen what Alec Muffett has been doing around this and its telling that the EFF is doing basically nothing.

Re: EFF is leaving X

#983

Post by throwawaypath »

flawn wrote: post #974
throwawaypath wrote: post #934

Earlier quoted context omitted.

O'Sullivan's First Law: "All organizations that are not actually right-wing will over time become left-wing." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_O%27Sullivan_(columnist)#...

And that is because the right or the left moves further away in the political space? By definition it seems to be the right-wing moving more extreme rather than non right-wing all moving together towards the left.

Entryism. By definition it seems to be the left-wing moving more extreme rather than non left-wing all moving together towards the right. Democrats have shifted more to the left than Republicans to the right: https://archive.is/IILDt

Re: EFF is leaving X

#984

Post by pmdr »

lynndotpy wrote: post #375
pmdr wrote: post #234

> We'll Keep Fighting. Just Not on X Yeah, somewhere where regular people that aren't terminally online won't ever have the chance to see it. This is a dumb decision. I'd very much like for open, distributed social networks to win, but that's not a reality we'll be living in anytime soon. X, for better or worse, gets you eyes, more so than any other alternative social media.

> X, for better or worse, gets you eyes, more so than any other alternative social media. This is not true at all, and it's a silly statement. X isn't mainstream anymore, and the people who think it is are simply stuck in a bubble. I suspect you might be one of the "terminally online people" you're denigrating as not "regular people". X's MAU is in the ballpark as Quora or Pinterest. "Pinterest gets you more eyes tha…

> This is not true at all, and it's a silly statement. X isn't mainstream anymore, and the people who think it is are simply stuck in a bubble.

Most organizations have an X account and announce things there because people actually see it. Most prominent political figures are there as well.

> I suspect you might be one of the "terminally online people"

Depends on what that means for you. For me it means people that can't stop posting and commenting, that have made social media their life. I don't qualify for that.

> you're denigrating as not "regular people".

Not really denigrating, it's more like people that are on alternative social media might already be more conscious about what the EFF is and does, so they're the ones that need it the least.

Re: EFF is leaving X

#985

Post by nos7rket »

WatchDog wrote: post #832
lynndotpy wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, EFF is a civil liberties group and always has been, which makes it a purely ideological movement. Let's be honest and look at the engagement numbers of the post announcing this: X post: 124 comments, 79 reblogs, and 337 likes BlueSky post: 245 comments, 1400 reblogs, and 6.2K likes Mastodon post: 403 reposts, 458 likes These numbers, combined with the facts that Mastodon and BlueSky are aligned with internet fre…

At the present moment, the X post made it to 898 comments, before they locked replies. The bluesky post has 426 comments.

[dead]

Re: EFF is leaving X

#986

Post by soundnote »

flawn wrote: post #974
throwawaypath wrote: post #934

Earlier quoted context omitted.

O'Sullivan's First Law: "All organizations that are not actually right-wing will over time become left-wing." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_O%27Sullivan_(columnist)#...

And that is because the right or the left moves further away in the political space? By definition it seems to be the right-wing moving more extreme rather than non right-wing all moving together towards the left.

[flagged]

Re: EFF is leaving X

#987

Post by smoovb »

butterNaN wrote: post #913

I am puzzled, not at EFF - this decision seems congruent with their ideals - no, I'm puzzled at the amount of comments on here that care so deeply about them staying on X, so much to garner 1000+ comments! So many people here seem to be taking this move as an offense at themselves. Why do people care so much about a private social media site?

Maybe most people here are social platform agnostic and thus EFF's limply constructed reasoning does not make make much sense for a brand trying to maximise their audience. Unless EFF are not platform agnostic and hold some view of the kinds of social platforms they are on. Then this EFF action makes sense.

Re: EFF is leaving X

#988

Post by smoovb »

j4k0bfr wrote: post #869

The amount and tone of discourse on this post is blowing my mind a little bit. I appreciate the criticism and concern about EFF's justification (it definitely seems a bit arbitrary) and would be a bit pissed if I was a donor. But X is so clearly an actively hostile, botted, and controlled platform. Does the hn crowd really value X so much? Or is this comment section also getting botted lol.

I am a donor and the EFF post feels performative and political. They still post to Flickr!

Re: EFF is leaving X

#990

Post by HereIGoAgain »

gonzobonzo wrote: post #752
supern0va wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>X, for better or worse, gets you eyes, more so than any other alternative social media. But that is actually what they called out: they're not getting eyes anymore. Views at X have cratered so hard that it's barely worth the time.

I just checked their Facebook and X page. The X page is getting much more eyes. For instance, they posted their article "The FAA’s “Temporary” Flight Restriction for Drones is a Blatant Attempt to Criminalize Filming ICE" to both accounts. The results: X: 1,500 likes, 50 comments, 846 shares. Facebook: 58 likes, 8 comments, 22 shares. Bluesky: 94 likes, 3 comments, 51 shares.

Yeah, the idea that this is simply, mostly or even partly about engagement/eyes is bunk on it's face. I'd even argue it a bad faith position to defend.
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