Live data from Hacker News

The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

moneywise.com

961–970 of 1001 posts

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#961

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not true. Automobiles have become vastly better at all price points over the last 50 years. Safer, more fuel efficient and longer-lasting. The same applies to smartphones, PCs, televisions, etc. And laser eye surgery. And passenger air travel since the Carter administration de-centralized (de-regulated) it in the late 1970s.

I won't comment much on automobiles - I don't buy new, and don't know anyone who buys new. It's all used market, and we're dreading the day the newest, touchscreen-controlled cars will be all that's available. But it appears to me that this market is highly regulated - safety, fuel efficiency and longevity still hit the bare minimum, just the legal minima have been tightened over the years. Laser eye surgery - I wasn…

Automobiles are better in all respects nowadays:

https://web.archive.org/web/20201130142349/https://www.reddi...

>Cars are made to be recyclable now.

>Overall, the last 30 years have seen a revolution in automobile design. Better materials, longer reliability, and yes ease in repair.

>My grandfather restores classic cars, and I've been driving for 20 years. My first car was a '73 Volkswagen Beetle and he has Fords from the 50s-70s. I don't think he's even ever been in a car that wasn't a Ford. His daily driver is a F150, and my grandmother's is a Crown Vic-- both of which are a decade old.

>Nowadays, cars are built to survive, and they survive for years longer than cars from the 50s, 60s, or 70s. And once they're done for, they're designed to be easily recycled for reuse in other cars or products.

>Looking under the hood of my Outback, I see that the entire wiring harness has thick plastic coating, ABS plastic weatherproof connectors, and every inch of free-floating wire is wrapped in a wire loom.

>Compare that to a 50s-60s Ford or Chevy, with cloth-wrapped wires and bare metal compression fittings that corroded after six months.

>In my Subaru, the metal is galvanized, and heat/weight sensitive bits on the undercarriage are made out of aluminum.

>In a 50s-60s Chevy or Ford, the metal would have been bare steel, maybe with a coat of paint that would chip and flake off the first time you drove down a gravel road, and the bottom would rust out after the first wet winter.

>The engine in my Outback is 2.5L and outputs about 175 HP. It has gone over 120,000 miles without a single problem. The only maintenance I've done is an oil and air filter changes. It's about 25% over mileage for its timing belt replacement, but I'll get around to that eventually.

>A 50's-60's Ford or Chevy V8 might be around 5L and might put out about 210-250 HP (FACTORY STOCK NON-MUSCLE VERSIONS). It would also require religious maintenance every 2500 miles or so (monthly). Not only that, but after just a couple of years the seals would start going and it would start burning oil like a thirsty camel refilling its hump after a long desert trek.

>People are also replacing their vehicles less often now. Back in my grandfather's day and age, he would get a new car every other year. Now people are keeping their cars for 8-10 years.

>Average Age of Vehicles Reaches Record High, According to Polk [1]

>Back in the 70's, the Honda sedan was REVOLUTIONARY because it would go 30,000 miles without a major problem. Overnight people were introduced to a small, reliable car that wouldn't cost an arm and a leg to maintain. Now it is considered completely pedestrian, unremarkable, average even, for a car to hit 100k with no problems whatsoever. Back in "the day" this was something Mercedes-Benz sent you a metal medallion to affix to your front grille to celebrate.

>That plastic bumper won't rust, won't deform after a brush up against a light post, is easy to recycle, and doesn't need to be welded or riveted into place, just pop out some retaining clips and replace the bumper. Plus, it won't kill someone if you hit them at 15mph, and it will absorb much more impact than the ungalvanized steel plate that used to be used in bumpers and fenders. The old "good" metal bumpers and fenders would transfer near 100% of collision energy to the passenger compartment, and they would start rusting the minute the paint got chipped in the wheel well.

>If you took a "good 'ole" metal car like a Galaxie 500 or Chevelle from back in the day and crashed it at 40mph head-long into a 2012 Toyota Camry, the Camry driver would walk away with scratches and bruises, and the EMTs would be prying the steering column out of the metal car driver's sternum.

Air travel at any quality grade is more affordable. It's true new budget tier offerings with fewer amenities have been created, but that has made air travel vastly more accessible than it once was, so I don't see it as a negative.

Laser eye surgery along with cosmetic procedures are vastly less regulated than the rest of healthcare, and coincidentally, the only areas of medicine where costs have declined for procedures after adjusting for inflation. [2]

Bottom tier smartphones are far more capable than the first generation of smartphones, which was the $800 (inflation adjusted) iPhone.

[1] https://web.archive.org/web/20150309023831/http://press.ihs....

[2] https://www.healthworkscollective.com/wp-content/uploads/201...

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#962
post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, I think I got your question now; you mean to ask; "What makes you think that all that wealth is not rightly earned by the rich people. They are producing value, that's why they are rich." At least that my interpretation, let me know if I got that wrong. Sure, let's have a look at https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2020/09/social-mobility-upwar ... We can assume that industrious, ingenious people with the will to to g…

That still doesn't mean that people who are rich didn't get there by providing value to others. E.g. Bill Gates made software that almost every business in the world chose to pay him for. Social mobility stats aren't relevant to that question.

Yeah, from shoestring to millionaire, right? Not so much.

Bill Gates was born into an already very wealthy family. He enjoyed an top notch education, had access to promising early technology and - maybe most important, had connections through his friends and family that he could leverage.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Gates#IBM_partnership

His most important deal he didn't make because he creating a unique value, but because of - some might argue - somewhat shady business practices, where he ripped off the value created by someone else.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/86-DOS#Creation_of_PC_DOS

He made money by arbitration of value. That is not the same as creating that value.

I doubt that there was anything uniquely special of value created by Bill Gates that justifies him having access to a million times the resources that an everyday citizen has.

I don't doubt that he's a hard and dedicated worker. But I've already made the argument that this is not the factor deciding whether you get rich or not.

Luck, preparation, luck, endurance, luck, risk-taking and luck are. By being rich, you can make sure you have the preparation, the endurance and the capacity for risk-taking. You still need luck.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#963
post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've noticed this with my parents — for decades they reacted negatively to any changes the regulations around Australia's housing market, since that was and remains the principal personal wealth creation mechanism in Australia... Until they reached retirement age. Then the painful realisation that, without plentiful housing, rental prices would consume most of their government pension. Now they're one expense away fr…

The sold also the last property from their flipping endeavours or investment portfolio? ouch.

Divorce, largely.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#964

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As if you can live anywhere without paying in perpetuity. If there wasn't an endless drive to increase the value of homes, this would all be moot.

Hate the game, not the players. All my friend's parents that didn't own their homes are completely fucked now that they're old, retired and their pensions didn't keep up with inflation. If you don't own the place you live you're just a rent hike away from the streets.

Yeah, I clearly indicated I hate the game.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#965

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can’t built a “$2k rental”. You can only build a rental that someone will pay for. Landlords are building luxury housing because it’s the only thing that’s profitable right now due to the immensely ridiculous laws that don’t help people. That's what I'm asking: Exactly which laws? Nobody seems to be specific.

Lots of people are specific, but it's a HUGE set of laws, and they're slightly different in different places. Like if someone says to you "supply restrictions due to single family zoning", someone else will say "Well Houston doesn't have that", but Houston allows you to sue your neighbor if they cast a shadow on your property, so it's a different method that gets to the same result.

Outside of a few Major cities, I’ve never seen these laws. Is it a boogie man? Where I live, the developers rule.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#966

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, I can name plenty of people near me who hold full time jobs without needing a four year degree.

Anecdotally, plenty of people win the lottery. It does not make playing a sound strategy or something that works on average. Sure, some will be alright. However, looking at statistics, the best way of not falling behind in terms of income is to get a good degree. Because that’s what we are talking about: average wages have been increasing more slowly than inflation for quite a few decades now. So we are talking about…

Going for a college drop is analogous to the lottery, because losers will end up further behind those that skipped the expensive degree and lost money to inflation.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#967

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These companies hardly exist, "evil corporations" is just super memeable and denizens of the internet will accept it as the answer to anything bad. In reality, the economy has been booming for the "haves" and those people are the ones bidding up homes and pay $50k over asking with a 6.5% mortgage. Corporations don't care much for home rentals when treasuries are paying 5% with zero overhead and zero risk. Sucks to be…

So BlackRock and Vanguard didn't buy up swathes of housing out competing individuals by offering above asking price and then rent or landbank that housing?

That was two years ago.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#968

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> has always been underfunded to make it look bad. I Yes, the "secret capitalists hiding in the woodpile" theory of why communism sucks. You, of course, are immune to the other side's propaganda, and your own brain is a perfect simulator of the real world so you've run mental experiments that prove to you irrefutably how awesome it would be. If only other people paid for it for you. > That's why it happens, outside o…

> Yes, the "secret capitalists hiding in the woodpile" theory of why communism sucks. Are you saying the United States is secretly ran by communists, and that there is a conspiracy theory that those secret communists are secretly ran by secret capitalists?

He's saying that. His contention was the projects looks bad because "has always been underfunded to make it look bad."

Ignoring, of course, that there are so many other factors that make those look bad, that would continue to make them look bad even if they were properly funded (whatever that absurd number might be).

I just summarized what he was saying.

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#969

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What government policy would allow for a 2k apartment building and not a $500 apartment building? Basically all of them? All you need is minimum parking + a height limit. Since the ROI of the lot is a function of units *average price, and a height limit + parkinng requirements caps the # of units per lot, the average price has to be higher for it to make sense to an investor. Also it’s worth noting that supply is j…

I read today that there are 7 billion square feet of unsold homes in China. Apparently no government can get housing right. The west has too little due to bad regulation & NIMBYs. China built too much (due to certain regulations being too lax it seems, and corruption probably). https://www.reuters.com/world/china/even-chinas-14-bln-popul...

I think both are failures of planning over markets. China propped up giant companies that built whole cities speculatively, but in the US it’s a that they have comparatively strong municipalities that prevent new building in their neighborhoods. I think the solution there is to weaken the strength of these zoning laws. We have been kinda running an experiment across states and cities and can see the housing crisis is worse in places with stricter zoning laws. https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/IN/IN12195

Re: The elderly are becoming homeless at a rate not seen since the Great Depression

#970
I realize this is generally an unpopular opinion around these parts but the way I see it we need more government intervention. The government needs to get back into the business of building affordable housing and needs to fund more needs based housing to help those who can’t afford market rates. They’re the only ones big enough to make a difference and without a profit movtive they’re the only ones who can reasonably make it happen. Private corporations aren’t going to do it because they won’t make enough or any money.
Post reply on HN