Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

europeanbusinessmagazine.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

911–920 of 1001 posts

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#911

Post by joe_mamba »

locknitpicker wrote: post #819
joe_mamba wrote: post #730

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> Jacques BAUD and Xavier MOREAU, Swiss and French nationals respectively, were sanctioned by the EU along with a laundry list of Russian nationals, on the accusation of being russian mouthpieces (...) If this is the best example you can muster, you don't have much of a case. They are Russian nationals pushing propaganda for a totalitarian regime which has been engaging in wars of annexation throughout Europe and who…

>They are Russian nationals pushing propaganda for a totalitarian regime which has been engaging in wars of annexation throughout Europe and whose threats of nuclear war against Europe are pushed on almost on a daily basis.

Where's the proof beyond reasonable doubt resulting from a trial, that those European citizens have done the things you say?

Or is Euro News propaganda supposed to be the only proof on which EU gets to throw people in jail without trial?

Shouldn't you get a trial where you get a chance to defend yourself before being sanctioned? I swear you people are cheering for 1984 authoritarianism to buttfuck you.

>Nevertheless, it's stupid to even consider the idea that only foreign nationals can be foreign agents.

As long as they are EU citizens, they deserve a fair EU trial and not just get sanctioned because EU says "trust me bro" about people they want to see disappeared.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#912

Post by Sharparam »

KaiserPro wrote: post #370
tlogan wrote: post #5

So Wero is not a credit card, but something more like Venmo? How is it supposed to replace Visa and Mastercard?

Venmo isn't needed, because bank transfers are free and "real time" as in even better, its not public.

> Venmo isn't needed, because bank transfers are free and "real time" as in This depends highly on what countries and banks are involved.

If I (as a Swede) want to send money to my german friend, I have to use Revolut or Wise since going through my bank is an enormous hassle and involves higher fees.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#913

Post by dj0k3r »

crossroadsguy wrote: post #648
severino wrote: post #135

Whatever they come up with, I hope it doesn't tie you to a Google or Apple smartphone. Can't we have cards for this? In Spain, for example, to use Bizum, you need either an Android/iOS smartphone (and for the Android case, as you use it from your bank's app, it would typically require some Google security assurances - so no Huawei phones allowed, for example) or logging into your bank's website and use Bizum from the…

They should just do on the lines of what India has been doing with UPI and Brazil with Pix. Both massively successful at this point. Of course take their good parts. By the way, since you wondered, it seems to be > built around the digital wallet Wero and wikipedia says its a mobile payments method. I hope not. I hope it's rather an interface/spec. (On a side note, I also hope individual countries of EU ensure that t…

> Of course take their good parts.

I completely agree. Sadly UPI is now almost completely dependant on platform integrity ( google and apple).

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#914

Post by joe_mamba »

locknitpicker wrote: post #823
joe_mamba wrote: post #759

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Moreau is apparently a Russian citizen living in Russia since 2013. Is he not still a French born citizen deserving of a fair trial? Or should getting a dual citizenship of a foreign passport, of a nation that later becomes an adversary, become an automatic death sentence? US should then put all it citizens with Cuban and Iranian passports in jail with that logic. And then what about Jacques BAUD who's Swiss living…

> Or should getting a dual citizenship of a foreign passport, of a nation that later becomes an adversary, become an automatic death sentence? You seem to be invested in trying to stitch together flimsy arguments based on specious reasoning. Your so-called victims are Russian agents with Russian nationality which have been engaged directly with a totalitarian regime that is engaged in war across Europe, both cold and…

>Your so-called victims are Russian agents

WHere's the proof that they are? Would you be OK is someone accused you of being a russian agent because you criticized the EU too much, and sanction you with no opportunity to defend yourself in court?

>You don't even try to argue for innocence.

Why would I? I don't know if they are innocent, that's why I want a public trial.

>You know they are agents and guilty

I Don't know that. That's just what the EU told us. That's why I want a public trial.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#915

Post by mrsssnake »

self_awareness wrote: post #671
mrsssnake wrote: post #519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not anonymous even for small amounts of money. Without tricks and workarounds Blik apps requires Google/Apple approved smartphone with Google/Apple approved build of the OS logged into Google/Apple account. Participation in the network is tied to private will have Blik association even on small scale.

I don't think having anonymous transactions is the goal for most people. For sure it's not the goal for Blik. The requirement of having a Google/Apple-cerified phone is a requirement of bank apps I think, not Blik's.

It does not matter on which layer the restrictions are applied here. Effect on society is the same - ability to pay only for those that give up on basic freedoms (which anonimity of payments and choice of device you carry are).

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#916

Post by piltdownman »

pb7 wrote: post #882
deadlocked wrote: post #656

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’ll give you a small handful of examples, of which a number occurred in the UK (famously not a member of the EU), most of which were actually arrests for incitement, and of the remainder the majority were thrown out before ever going to trial, or subsequently on appeal. Very few of the cases they present will have involved citizens being murdered in the streets by the government for exercising their absolute righ…

The UK has more arrests for social media posts than any other country in the world, including authoritarian countries like Russia, Belarus, etc. Germany is the third highest. Both have thousands, not "a small handful".

Ah, the Joe Rogan school of geopolitics finally rears its HGH malformed head

{1}https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/wales-englan... {2}https://pa.media/blogs/fact-check/fact-check-international-d... {3}https://www.standard.co.uk/news/tommy-robinson-uk-speech-cla...

Most of the erroneous conclusions come from a cursory interpretation of a Times article from last year:

{4} https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/police-make-30-arr...

In 2023, UK police forces made around 12,000 arrests under the Communications Act 2003 and the Malicious Communications Act 1988. These laws cover sending messages that are "grossly offensive, threatening, indecent, or menacing over communications networks" (which includes social media). Prosecutions resulting tend to come from a small subset of serious crimes - stalking, incitement to hatred, endangering minors etc...

This was gleefully misinterpreted by Musk, Steven Forbes and the rest of the right-wing braintrust as "12,000 people were arrested for saying politically incorrect things."

Germany at third highest is equally in the realm of complete fantasy. The Tagesschau debunked it and concluded that the German numbers make no sense. There is no statistic in Germany for the number of arrests, but the number of people investigated is lower for the period claimed and not all led to arrests so the number is simply a fabrication.

https://www.tagesschau.de/faktenfinder/grafik-festnahmen-onl...

Finally, the notion that China or Russia would self-report less cases than the UK and expect the figure to be believed is farcical. There isn't even something comparable to the anti-activism laws or the HK47 in the UK.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#917

Post by [deleted] »

pb7 wrote: post #882
deadlocked wrote: post #656

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They’ll give you a small handful of examples, of which a number occurred in the UK (famously not a member of the EU), most of which were actually arrests for incitement, and of the remainder the majority were thrown out before ever going to trial, or subsequently on appeal. Very few of the cases they present will have involved citizens being murdered in the streets by the government for exercising their absolute righ…

The UK has more arrests for social media posts than any other country in the world, including authoritarian countries like Russia, Belarus, etc. Germany is the third highest. Both have thousands, not "a small handful".

[deleted]

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#918

Post by tremon »

Hikikomori wrote: post #272
SomeUserName432 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would never buy a plane ticket on debit. Airbnb reservations I also tend to do on credit. Anything related to company expenses I also do on credit and receive reimbursement prior to having to pay it myself.

In Europe you typically have travel insurance on debit cards as well.

It's usually not tied to the debit card, but plenty of banks offer ad-hoc travel insurance as part of an options package with their checking accounts.

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#919

Post by dj0k3r »

crossroadsguy wrote: post #650
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An Indian friend of mine, constantly raves about their UPI system: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_Payments_Interface It sounds a lot like what they're discussing.

Oh it is good. It has its drawbacks (like everything else) but it's quite the de facto now and UPI Lite ( a wallet not on individual apps but on UPI/NCPI f/w itself) had made it even better.

There's so much trust / dependency on NPCI at this point but I recently learned that it's not a public entity and thus excluded from the transparency acts such as RTI. I hope the EU does better!

Re: Europe's $24T Breakup with Visa and Mastercard Has Begun

#920

Post by mgce »

Sharparam wrote: post #907
Freak_NL wrote: post #734

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why would you expect people not living in the Netherlands to just know this? Because this is a thing in most of Europe. Most people don't own a creditcard, and those that do use it mostly for online purchases outside of the EU. I don't travel to another continent without looking up how to pay for things when I get there.

This is definitely not a thing in most of Europe. Netherlands' anti-credit card stance is quite unique, perhaps only matched by Germany and their obsession with cash.

I was just in Germany and lived on my credit card - not a single Euro used. I strongly disagree with this generalization based on extensive personal experience.
Post reply on HN