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I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

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Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#91
post #49
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is difficult to see how Gandhi's methods could be applied in a country where opponents of the regime disappear in the middle of the night and are never heard of again. Without a free press and the right of assembly, it is impossible not merely to appeal to outside opinion, but to bring a mass movement into being, or even to make your intentions known to your adversary. -- George Orwell There are places on earth wh…

When I was growing up, one of the standard places that used to be cited for this line of reasoning was the Eastern Block. And certainly looking at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prague_Spring there was evidence that peaceful protest wouldn't work. But what happened? Oh right. Peaceful protest brought down the Soviet block.

I'm a little young, so I don't have as much perspective of the recent history as you do.

But every instance of non-violent non-co operation(Lets call it with the name Gandhi gave to it - ahimsa/satyagraha) works only because of the opponents get weak after a point of time. Indian Independence movement worked because in the course of WW2 the British lost the gumption they had earlier to control a nation as big as India. They were running out of resources, ideas and means to stay in India anymore. Gandhi's movement gave British too much bad across the world. Plus WW2 and WW1 had really taken a toll on the British. So it was a mixture of all these things + Gandhi's movement that make ahims/satyagraha work.

I guess its the same with USSR too? Didn't this whole cold war thing come too heavy on the Soviets? The way I understand they were in deep financial crisis and were facing an imminent defeat in Afghanistan.

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#92

Damn, she's pretty hot although the accent kind of kills my boner. I wonder though would I have clicked 'Play' on the video without the screenshot of the pretty Ukrainian blonde girl, say in the place of a Ukrainian male partisan of the same age? Was her message more persuasive through her voice and feminine presentation? The fact that my Ghostery plugin had registered 16 trackers (including Buzzfeed.com) on thoughtc…

mmm, soma.

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#93
post #16

And again this is extremely one-sided. Propagandistic even. And it makes it to the top of HN. Again. "THE POLICE IS READY TO SHOOT". But she won't say that it's with rubber slugs or that the protesters are throwing molotovs and shooting fireworks (which can deal nasty damage). Rocks are implied, I think. I tried to really dig into the affair, but it's too complicated with both sides corrupt (like it typically happens…

Thank you for that. As a European, I would add that you really need to be aware that the country seems to be split along historical lines: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/01/24... It seems that Kiev, the capital, happens to be in a region that is dominated by Ukrainian-speaking people, who feel closer to (Western/Central) Europe than to Russia. Therefore, a lot of protests are happening in the…

Fun fact:

Kiev was settled by a group that, although they were linguistically part of Northern rather than Eastern Europe, gave their name to Russia.

Fun fact, this group also effectively began the Russian Orthodox tradition.

I am referring of course to the Kievian Rus, for whom Russia was named, but who were basically to the Russians what the Normans were to the French....

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#94
post #90

I can't believe this kind of submission manages to work on HN. This is pure clickbait devoid of any content. Nothing to spark a debate or "gratify one's intellectual curiosity", to cite the guidelines. It's just "Click here if you want the good guys (us) to win!", and people are clicking. Amazing. And people are wondering why long-form journalism is dying.

Your comment manages to be on top despite having little content. So?

EDIT: HN is not a journalistic site. So don't worry about the decline of journalism in this context.

Personally, I think it is very legitimate to appeal to sentiments, because of the three means of persuasion (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetoric_%28Aristotle%29) pathos foremost agitates people to actions. And sometimes, it is necessary to act (and inform the public). That you disagree with others on this very issue is no reason for insult.

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for that. As a European, I would add that you really need to be aware that the country seems to be split along historical lines: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/worldviews/wp/2014/01/24... It seems that Kiev, the capital, happens to be in a region that is dominated by Ukrainian-speaking people, who feel closer to (Western/Central) Europe than to Russia. Therefore, a lot of protests are happening in the…

Belgium was split along historical lines but they talked over their differences and found common ground. The result of that was the beginning of the European Union which is why Brussels, Belgium is the EU capital today. So why can't the Ukrainians solve their problems the EU way?

Belgium had a lot of problems recently. Even if it is not on the same order of magnitude than Ukraine, there are conflicts between both parts. Not so long ago, they did not find a way to form a government for several months and they often speak of splitting.

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#97
post #94
post #90

I can't believe this kind of submission manages to work on HN. This is pure clickbait devoid of any content. Nothing to spark a debate or "gratify one's intellectual curiosity", to cite the guidelines. It's just "Click here if you want the good guys (us) to win!", and people are clicking. Amazing. And people are wondering why long-form journalism is dying.

Your comment manages to be on top despite having little content. So? EDIT: HN is not a journalistic site. So don't worry about the decline of journalism in this context. Personally, I think it is very legitimate to appeal to sentiments, because of the three means of persuasion ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetoric_%28Aristotle%29 ) pathos foremost agitates people to actions. And sometimes, it is necessary to act (a…

In Rome, do as the Romans. Simias's post has much more content than the video, and makes a self-contained argument. The link submitted presents a page with a video imploring us to... what.. share the video? Because it will make a difference? Why? Also, what are we making a difference in again? Why is the government a dictatorship? When did that happen? (I'm not asking, I'm saying the video doesn't answer any of the above questions, which are critical to the appeal for support)

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#98

This is a pure propaganda piece that shows nothing other than some skill in video editing and constructing a sound track. Think, people, think. Do you want to spread this message in your countries? This summer when there is an Occupy or 99% demonstration in your country, do you want young men in helmets and masks carrying baseball bats and molotov cocktails to take charge of it? Will you carry a pistol with you at th…

This attitude is a big problem at best and purposefully dangerous at worst. In most systematic oppressive situations the smaller voice gets very few moments to speak. All issues are complex and worse yet opaque, but videos serve as smoke, and when your eye follows the smoke sometimes you find fire and sometimes you dont. So now people can peruse their own facts and share this video to others who might jump in the fra…

That's the answer to the comment about "this post does not gratify intellectual curiosity!", thank you.

Don't get this video as it is, look for additional facts about Ukrainian protests, make your opinion - that is a noble goal of the video, though it should be stressed more for HN.

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#99

This is a pure propaganda piece that shows nothing other than some skill in video editing and constructing a sound track. Think, people, think. Do you want to spread this message in your countries? This summer when there is an Occupy or 99% demonstration in your country, do you want young men in helmets and masks carrying baseball bats and molotov cocktails to take charge of it? Will you carry a pistol with you at th…

I hope that the rhetoric employed in your comment was deliberate and meant to be ironic...

Re: I Am A Ukrainian, This Needs To Go Viral

#100
post #42
post #33

Please, the Ukrainian rebels are pretty much controlled by the US, who are using fascist elements to increase the level of violence. Molotov cocktails and fireworks aren't exactly 'non-violent'. The police response has been quite measured I think...

Controlled by the US? Citation needed.

Nuland-Pyatt call

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSxaa-67yGM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26079957

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