Live data from Hacker News

New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

wired.com

91–100 of 147 posts

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#91
post #9

The AI data center narrative is the perfect storm: First most of the data center build out is happening in areas that have had little other opportunity so local resistance is muted. Abilene, Texas is referenced and is the kind of place my grandfather would lovingly say is where you go to learn to be a “dirt farmer” Second, every environmentalist in the US is fighting 100 different battles with the most anti-regulatio…

The Netherlands banned hyperscalers. But it's a rich country that can afford it.

At least a steel plant or refinery actually provides jobs for the locals. These American AI companies are just carpetbagger Yankies.

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#93
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emitting as much greenhouse gas as a country? That has a body count. It's hard to know which people you're killing, but there's no doubt that at that point there's a number. Maybe... 10,000 or so? They'll die in heat waves and floods and tornadoes and food shortages in dry, poor countries. Obviously 10k is a tiny fraction of the full list of climate fatalities.

But isn't it kind of one-sided to single out data centers like that?

Most emissions are harder to reduce because industry isn't electrified (it runs directly on oil/coal not electricity). This is electricity usage. Electricity emissions are the easiest to avoid.

AI industry also promises to replace everyone, and they have access to large amounts of capital they could use for renewables.

That they punch down on everyone, including people outside of their country who don't benefit from the tax revenue they'll generate, with massive amounts of emissions, is a slap in the face.

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#94
post #17
post #9

The AI data center narrative is the perfect storm: First most of the data center build out is happening in areas that have had little other opportunity so local resistance is muted. Abilene, Texas is referenced and is the kind of place my grandfather would lovingly say is where you go to learn to be a “dirt farmer” Second, every environmentalist in the US is fighting 100 different battles with the most anti-regulatio…

Don’t forget environmentalists have been fighting against nuclear energy for decades. Update: Since I’m being downvoted I’m going to add a little sting: Good luck with your solar power web servers and skipping flights. Poor judgement really does have a price. It’s now inevitable that it’s going to get a bit warmer… everywhere. We’ll be lucky to hit Net Zero by 2100.

Even ignoring nuclear environmentalists are still the enemy here.

Green energy is diffuse. Fields of solar. Ridges dotted with turbines. Each unit needs a power cable running away from it, access roads, etc, etc. A lot of area has to be developed for a given payback (sellable power).

Environmentalists and have been instrumental in making it economically impossible to develop land cheap enough to make low value density projects like that pencil out.

The higher power cost states in the US would likely be dotted with all manner of solar infill if not for up front costs that these shortsighted and selfish people have imposed on any land alteration larger than approx SFH lot size. Farmer Johnson would love nothing more than to put up solar on that ~2ac hillside he owns but cannot farm economically. Neither he nor some 3rd party who would put up the panels will shell out half a mil for an EPA CG permit just to clear the vegetation because the panels will never pay that back in their lives.

The economics of compliance are why the only greenfield development that happens these days is value dense commercial stuff (shopping plaza, big box store, data center, office buildings etc) or dense SFH development.

The most rosy possible outlook is that we "just" wait for the hippie boomers who cooked this crap up to croak, shit can the clean water act and come up with some new way of regulating development that doesn't saddle these super low impact projects (it's hard to be lower impact than panels or turbines) with fixed-ish costs that are a non-starter except at huge scale.

But of course there are so many parties who are making rent off this broken system who won't go down without a fight.

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#95
post #9

The AI data center narrative is the perfect storm: First most of the data center build out is happening in areas that have had little other opportunity so local resistance is muted. Abilene, Texas is referenced and is the kind of place my grandfather would lovingly say is where you go to learn to be a “dirt farmer” Second, every environmentalist in the US is fighting 100 different battles with the most anti-regulatio…

Abilene, Texas is also a great place to build a solar power plant with some batteries and reduce the gas bills for these datacenters. EDIT: I am not suggesting that they don’t build gas turbines or go off grid. I’m saying they can save fuel by using solar when it’s there.

Everyone is talking about batteries but honestly you don’t need batteries.

- Data centers don’t sleep

- Data center load (for AI) could be shifted to follow the sun

- The energy requirements mean you aren’t likely to overbuild your solar farm

At night just stop running your GPUs and / or pull from the grid

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#96
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There isn't a battery in the world big enough to provide enough power for data enter if this size. Some batteries in this case is a bit like saying some water about the Pacific ocean.

A big AI data center uses about 1 GWh of power each night. A large battery storage site is about 500MWh. So this is totally doable and it’s also going to be economical as soon as the US has built enough LNG export capacity.

That's a big data enter from last decade. Today big data enters use 4GWh power in winter. So only 8 of them.

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Abilene, Texas is also a great place to build a solar power plant with some batteries and reduce the gas bills for these datacenters. EDIT: I am not suggesting that they don’t build gas turbines or go off grid. I’m saying they can save fuel by using solar when it’s there.

Everyone is talking about batteries but honestly you don’t need batteries. - Data centers don’t sleep - Data center load (for AI) could be shifted to follow the sun - The energy requirements mean you aren’t likely to overbuild your solar farm At night just stop running your GPUs and / or pull from the grid

Using GPUs as paperweights at night doesn't seem to be an efficient usage and it comes with its own costs. "Pull from the grid" is what they try not to do.

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#98
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emitting as much greenhouse gas as a country? That has a body count. It's hard to know which people you're killing, but there's no doubt that at that point there's a number. Maybe... 10,000 or so? They'll die in heat waves and floods and tornadoes and food shortages in dry, poor countries. Obviously 10k is a tiny fraction of the full list of climate fatalities.

But isn't it kind of one-sided to single out data centers like that?

It doesn't help that I think datacenters are the means of digital oppression rather than the means of digital empowerment.

Oppression is where you get people hooked on something but then lock it away and use your complete control over supply to extract rent. Gradually the rent will become so high that only the most abusive profit-seekers can afford to pay it.

Empowerment is owning technology so that its purpose is to work for you, rather than to extract rent from you. Tech that empowers individuals usually doesn't need giant chain-link fences around it.

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#99
post #68
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do people really think that uranium consuming reactors that produce plutonium are the only type of nuclear reactors?

Of the operating set of reactors today, what percentage are those vs., say, Thorium?

yes, but that is not the point. The point is that countries pursued uranium reactors as a priority to produce plutonium for weapons. It did not / does not have to be this way, and the conflation of all nuclear reactors as either being at risk of meltdown or linked to nuclear weapons has resulted in the current situation. The green movement did us all a disservice by choosing not to clarify the difference, and here we are in 2026 still burning coal, which continues to produce more radioactive waste than all the nuclear reactors ever built - and released directly into the environment!

Re: New gas-powered data centers could emit more greenhouse gases than whole nations

#100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Abilene, Texas is also a great place to build a solar power plant with some batteries and reduce the gas bills for these datacenters. EDIT: I am not suggesting that they don’t build gas turbines or go off grid. I’m saying they can save fuel by using solar when it’s there.

Everyone is talking about batteries but honestly you don’t need batteries. - Data centers don’t sleep - Data center load (for AI) could be shifted to follow the sun - The energy requirements mean you aren’t likely to overbuild your solar farm At night just stop running your GPUs and / or pull from the grid

Seems crazy to build an expensive factory and then cheap out on the power source so it can only run when it is sunny out
Post reply on HN