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The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

lesswrong.com

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Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#91
post #89
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

thanks for sharing that's helpful. I've heard similar to more moderate ill effects from the therapy

This video on YT explains the not much talked about side effects and risks that can come from egg retrieval. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAMrwAGR3GA

thanks . yeah i had a close family member do the same and it was a pretty long and painful process. it was > 10 years ago but I think the concerns are still similar.

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The grandparent situation is sad af. It's also pretty sad being a mid-40s year old dad that doesn't have the energy to keep up with their kid. I pitched a little league game yesterday and it wiped me out. Also, the fact I (and you) will not know our grandchildren very well also is quite sad. If my son has his first kid the same age I had him, I'll be in my 80s when that kid is starting little league (or that age). Th…

If you had kids earlier, you wouldn't get more time with the specific person you love that is your son, you'd get more time with a different son. No doubt you'd love your counterfactual son too. But you shouldn't feel bad for having done any wrong by your real kid. This is the only timeline he could exist in. Bit of a thorny philosophical argument, maybe, but reasonable in this case.

Have considered that as well but shared time with that person would have been more and I would be none the wiser to the actual timeline, so I feel it’s appropriate to treat them as the same “child” instead of theoretical kid vs actual kid and how I’m happy I waited because this kid is so cool, pretty sure I would have felt the same towards the other kid (who knows maybe not but even if he was a jerk of a kid I’d assume a delayed child would have also been a jerk too)

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The grandparent situation is sad af. It's also pretty sad being a mid-40s year old dad that doesn't have the energy to keep up with their kid. I pitched a little league game yesterday and it wiped me out. Also, the fact I (and you) will not know our grandchildren very well also is quite sad. If my son has his first kid the same age I had him, I'll be in my 80s when that kid is starting little league (or that age). Th…

>by delaying parenthood - I was just being selfish.. I minimized "shared time on earth" Exactly. My advice to anyone is not wait. If we hadn't, we would have found out sonner that we needed to go through that process. It's not a "wake up and schedule an appointment tomorrow" kind of thing, it's a treatment of last resort and you can burn years trying, going through evaluations and alternatives first.

Yeah I give same advice, if you know you want kids and found your partner just start soon. We didn’t have many fertility issues just weeding out some unfortunate genetics, but I’ve seen people try for years and it’s really taxing on both the individual and relationship.

The stuff we weeded out was on my wife’s side and the boy ended up being my clone. We joke about it as if we weeded out all of her genes. Even small things like his cowlicks and how his teeth are coming it are exactly like mine which I never would have expected to even be possible (I never gave it much thought tbh)

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went through it with my wife too and expecting a 19 y/o women to go through the IVF process as an insurance policy is a bit insane to me. In our modern, western society, this is age is still solidly childhood with not much definitive thoughts of future family, marriage, etc. Governments need to make COL more affordable, birth rate will go up naturally

Calling 19 "childhood" is crazy. Most teens have an understanding of what they want their life to look like.

It is crazy but it’s also quite true. People eschew true adult responsibility for much longer these days. It’s a macro trend.

I know there’s a lot of “whys” but not getting married, not having kids, living with parents, etc all compound to remaining a child in some sense and this is continuing well into the 20s and even 30s for a large portion of the demographic.

When it comes to 19 y/o women the fact most internet people would find it gross that 1) highly fertile and 2) desired by old men - is a reality. We tell old men these women are too young yet also won’t admit it’s because they are in some sense still children.

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#95

Since having kids is so tiring in the early years and often lead to a divorce, it is better to have them early when you are still fresh and handle better the lack of sleep, divorce early and then enjoy part time parenthood when you are still youngish. I feel I am a better parent now that I am sharing custody of my kids and can better balance personal life and hobbies and parenthood. A cheaper option would be to find…

Rather than accept divorce as an inevitability, there is also the option of discussing the possibility with your partner and making a mutual commitment to do what it takes to stay happy together.

Which is much easier with the added emotional maturity and life experience that comes with age.

Not to mention if you chose your partner after the age of 25.

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#96
post #89
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

thanks for sharing that's helpful. I've heard similar to more moderate ill effects from the therapy

This video on YT explains the not much talked about side effects and risks that can come from egg retrieval. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAMrwAGR3GA

The video was helpful and addressed many of the clinical and ethical concerns I have. Can you consent to a procedure that has a 30+ year impact? Are these treatments completely safety tested if long term studies are not being done? What are the ethics of making women take health risks for money, especially when health is increasing in value, and money is losing its value

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you had kids earlier, you wouldn't get more time with the specific person you love that is your son, you'd get more time with a different son. No doubt you'd love your counterfactual son too. But you shouldn't feel bad for having done any wrong by your real kid. This is the only timeline he could exist in. Bit of a thorny philosophical argument, maybe, but reasonable in this case.

Have considered that as well but shared time with that person would have been more and I would be none the wiser to the actual timeline, so I feel it’s appropriate to treat them as the same “child” instead of theoretical kid vs actual kid and how I’m happy I waited because this kid is so cool, pretty sure I would have felt the same towards the other kid (who knows maybe not but even if he was a jerk of a kid I’d assu…

> ...but shared time with that person would have been more

Sticking to the philosophical arguments, having the kid at any other time, even earlier would not guarantee more time with them. It would have drastically shifted your life events which could include ones that possibly shorten it.

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#98

Having done IVF with my wife I think this is the most underrated fertility advice available today. I don't understand why governments of countries with increasing average age and low birth rate don't pay for this for all women. This is one the best pro-family policies that can be implemented.

This is a peak silicon valley tech bro mentality view.

Instead of doing what the body is natural designed to do lets go fully against it because of the current environment.

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#99

This is an article that you need to read critically, beyond the headline. Even a few paragraphs down they say this: > The optimal age to freeze eggs varies depending on the source and metric, but almost all sources agree it's sometime between 19 and 26. So there's some heavy bias inserted already into the title. The next chart shows a peak around 19, but if you read the fine print it's not a chart about eggs at all.…

Well, the website is called lesswrong.com, and not correct.com.

They could have called it morewrong.com or morallywrong for all the right mathematical reasons instead. Their eugenics agenda is really more than a little bit tiresome at this point.

Re: The optimal age to freeze eggs is 19

#100

Having done IVF with my wife I think this is the most underrated fertility advice available today. I don't understand why governments of countries with increasing average age and low birth rate don't pay for this for all women. This is one the best pro-family policies that can be implemented.

Because (1) it's not risk free, (2) it is painful, (3) it is quite costly over the longer term (4) you wouldn't want a 'pro-family' government to have access to a mountain of unfertilized eggs.
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