Postel’s Law would put the onus on Google to be forgiving in what it receives. Unsure how you could safely use a sender-created Message-Id for anything anyway.
Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
91–100 of 443 posts
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#92I vaguely remember hitting this message id issue in Google Workspace, and being able to work around it in mail routing configuration.
Saidly I don't remember the specifics, it was something along the lines of not all, but only specific routing features requiring it. Workspace settings are a moving target anyway, so the behavior probably changed more than once since.
I'm not saying it's a good idea to send emails without message id, but i'd also double-check that workspace configuration.
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#93Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can argue that you not obligated to use message-id but if you don't use it you should blame only yourself that your messages are not accepted. In requiring message-id I would side with google (though in general I think they anti-spam is too aggressive and lacks ways to report false positives). Full RFC compliance (as in not only MUST but also SHOULD unless you have a very good reason) is the easiest part of makin…
On the other hand, by erroneously treating a SHOULD as a MUST, I would say that Google is the one who's not RFC-compliant
Google is rejecting it to ensure incoming messages aren't spam. SHOULD means "you should do this unless you have a really, really good reason not to." Do they have a good reason not to? It doesn't seem so, meaning Viva is in the wrong here.
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#94> Viva.com's outgoing verification emails lack a Message-ID header, a requirement that has been part of the Internet Message Format specification (RFC 5322) since 2008 > ... > `Message-ID` is one of the most basic required headers in email. Section 3.6. of the RFC in question ( https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc5322.html ) says: +----------------+--------+------------+----------------------------+ | Field | Min | Max…
The reason that European tech sucks is that people in Europe are open to such arguments. If an engineer in the US started talking about SHOULD vs MUST, some PM would just give them that "what the fuck did I just listen to" face, spend the next few minutes gently trying to convince them that the customer experience matters more than the spec, and if they fail, escalate and get the decision they want.
For example, why does Google handle this differently for consumer and enterprise accounts? Well it's Google so the answer could always just be "they are disorganized" but there's a good chance that in both cases, it was the pragmatic choice given the slightly different priorities of these types of customers.
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#95The bigger issue here is that Europe depends way too much on the USA in so many areas. This is not good - you can be constantly blackmailed when you have people such as Trump in charge. I don't think the EU can be fixed, but at the same time I also think the less Europeans depend on outside factors (in particular the USA) the better. Canada kind of showed how to do it. Granted, Canada is also dependent on the USA in…
As a European (who spent 15 years in the US), I coudln't agree more. And while I agree, at the end of the day, I just want the better product for me.
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#96Earlier quoted context omitted.
For producers, ignoring a SHOULD is riskier because it shifts the burden to every consumer. For consumers, ignoring a SHOULD mostly affects their own robustness. But here Google seems to understand it as a MUST... maybe the scale of spam is enough to justify it. Users are stuck between two parties that expect the other to behave.
> maybe the scale of spam is enough to justify it. This is 100 percent the case, and why these things are this way. If you wanted to make email two point oh, I dont think it would look a lot like what we have today.
> This is 100 percent the case, and why these things are this way.
But gmail accepts emails without message-id on personal mailboxes apparently.
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#97[deleted]
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#98Might want to consider Adyen, which should support IRIS, the Greek instant payment system.
Thank you for the recommendation! That I couldn't sign up using a form and I had to "talk to their team" was a turn-off for my (extremely extroverted) self.
Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#99The specific bug is annoying, but that there's no way to report such a thing is an exact hallmark of our current corposphere.
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Re: Major European payment processor can't send email to Google Workspace users
#100> Their support team's response to my detailed bug report: "your account has a verified email, so there's no problem." Sadly I doubt their system is xkcd806 compatible ether. This isn't an engineering problem, it's an ITIL problem. To be fair 99% of these complaints will be dealt with by the flow chart. Sadly people on the front line are either not knowledgable enough or not empowered enough to bust out of that strai…
SHIBBOLEET. I was seriously thinking of this when I contacted them :)