Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

91–100 of 120 posts

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#91

Post by ensignavenger »

sakesun wrote: post #90
ensignavenger wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Odoo is very open core, only a thin core is open source, whereas the vast majority of features are closed source.

That's not true. The enterprise part is much smaller than the open source part.

I'm not sure how you are measuring "size", but I was going on features.

Though I haven't done a formal review of which features are open and closed, and the xompany doesn't appear to document it anywhere, so I may be wrong. It seems like when I have looked into it in the past mostly it is a core framework with a few open source apps and whole bucnh of closed ones and the marketing doesn't clearly state what is open and closed.

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#92

Post by xuancanh »

vips7L wrote: post #86
xuancanh wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just a meme. The developer experience in Java is worse compared to some other popular programming languages like JavaScript, Go, Python, etc. The language is a bit verbose, and the compiling speed is slow, hence the development speed is slower. Java developers tend to overly abstract things, so the code tends to be unnecessarily complicated. The JVM also has a high memory footprint, the startup speed is slow…

It is a meme. I'm not sure if any of this is true and you seem to be contradicting yourself. Java is far less verbose than Go, and the compiler is leagues faster than kotlin's, graal's native compiler, probably most other languages, and I'm sure its faster than Babel. Javac doesn't do any optimizations, just emits bytecode. Why is it acceptable for Go to be verbose and kotlinc to be slow?

I'm not saying that Go or Kotlin is better than Java in all of those aspects. I'm just saying that Kotlin, GraalVM exists because Java, JVM have certain issues or limitation. For Golang, I'm just saying that the developer experience in Go is better. It's not just my personal experience, you can find the same result in any developer survey.

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#93

Post by somat »

imachine1980_ wrote: post #63
mgl wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Salesforce is a generic application platform today, and this is how see it. Openkoda is not a drop-in replacement for Salesforce CRM, it is a useful replacement when you want to build your core business application a) retaining full source code ownership and ability to get any Java/JS team to work on it and run anywhere you want, b) without becoming dependent on technology and commercial limitations of working with b…

>Salesforce is a generic application platform today Not is standard. You need to train your costumer in this interface you can simply contract employees who knows Salesforce.

I don't know much about salesforce, but if it is anything like every other "enterprise" grade software every installation is a special unique snowflake and you have to train the people on it anyway... Or more realistically you give them a 5 minute overview and let them flounder away a few weeks hating the infernal thing while they try and figure it out.

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#94

Post by anonzzzies »

righthand wrote: post #32

So a CRM that replicates Salesforce APIs? Sales people don’t want a Salesforce FOSS version, that’s why they green light salesforce. It’s about trend not practical software. Only dev teams that have been implementing Salesforce for 5 years want a FOSS version.

There are people building for decades on things like Ofbiz[0] because it's flexible and it's truly open source. There are open and closed projects built on top of it, because it's a flexible business system which allow you to quickly model and built anything. I know a few companies myself that replaced Salesforce with a custom Ofbiz implementations and local companies that do the implementations.

[0] https://github.com/apache/ofbiz-framework / https://ofbiz.apache.org/index.html

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#95

Post by nutrie »

mgl wrote: post #69
nutrie wrote: post #64

Sadly, I doubt anybody's going to beat Salesforce and other crap such as Workday unless it's the same crap selling under a different name. Corporate people want their featurez.

The good news here is that they are many businesses out of there which a) need an enterprise solution (data protection, dedicated cloud, multi-tenancy), b) have complex data processing patterns (think: underwriting a property policy with cyclone/flood coverage), and c) don't have an unlimited budget. I would leave corporations to work with corporations if they are really happy working together, but the world is much…

While I agree with you, you're missing my point :) I was talking about procurement practices.

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#96

Post by TZubiri »

righthand wrote: post #32

So a CRM that replicates Salesforce APIs? Sales people don’t want a Salesforce FOSS version, that’s why they green light salesforce. It’s about trend not practical software. Only dev teams that have been implementing Salesforce for 5 years want a FOSS version.

Free Sales software is quite an oxymoron

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#98

Post by liotier »

mgl wrote: post #36
righthand wrote: post #32

So a CRM that replicates Salesforce APIs? Sales people don’t want a Salesforce FOSS version, that’s why they green light salesforce. It’s about trend not practical software. Only dev teams that have been implementing Salesforce for 5 years want a FOSS version.

Salesforce is a generic application platform today, and this is how see it. Openkoda is not a drop-in replacement for Salesforce CRM, it is a useful replacement when you want to build your core business application a) retaining full source code ownership and ability to get any Java/JS team to work on it and run anywhere you want, b) without becoming dependent on technology and commercial limitations of working with b…

> Salesforce is a generic application platform today

Indeed. So, if one is going to customize the hell out of it anyway, with most of the functionality being extensions, then why not just use a free software core ? Vertical solutions providers might find profitable to serve their customers and not pay the Salesforce tax.

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#99

Post by lelanthran »

xuancanh wrote: post #57
promptingmetosi wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's plenty I'd like to improve but it's honestly in a very good shape. There's a reason enterprise picks Java - it's battle tested and there are enough quality developers around. Frameworks like Spring for webdev are top notch. Unless you've got a very specific reason to pick something else (python or rust or whatever) Java is the safe bet (along with c# but Java is an order of magnitude bigger I think). It's jus…

It's not just a meme. The developer experience in Java is worse compared to some other popular programming languages like JavaScript, Go, Python, etc. The language is a bit verbose, and the compiling speed is slow, hence the development speed is slower. Java developers tend to overly abstract things, so the code tends to be unnecessarily complicated. The JVM also has a high memory footprint, the startup speed is slow…

> The developer experience in Java is worse compared to some other popular programming languages like JavaScript, Go, Python,

Wait, what?

Go, maybe.

But the dev experience in languages that are only able to catch errors at runtime, like Javascript and Python, are painful!

Looking at existing Python/Node.js codebases, half the automated tests are there simply to catch errors that statically typed languages catch for free, and even those tests aren't a match for a statically-typed language anyway.

I hate, hate, hate, HATE working on languages where my only options are:

1. Pray that no future code calls this function I just wrote with the wrong parameter types.

2. Write tests for all the callers of that function, to defend against some caller getting called with some combination of arguments that result in the function being called with the wrong types, while knowing full well I can't cover all possible cases like I would in a statically typed language.

Honestly, the first step in writing software is modelling the data types and structures[1]. In Node.js and Python you can model all you want but enforcement is left to developer discretion.

At this point in time, having done a few Node.js and Python backends, the dev experience in c11 is superior.

In order of least painful to most painful, in my experience of writing backends:

1. Go 2. Java 3. C# 4. C 5. C++ 6. PHP, Python, Node, Ruby, etc.

Those languages in #6 above are popular because they allow you to hodge-podge your system together.

[1] The second step is modelling the data flow, of course.

Re: Show HN: Openkoda – Open–source, private, Salesforce alternative

#100

Post by rajamaka »

api wrote: post #70
tomrod wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Odoo's quest for monetization from open source has been a bit off-putting. I stopped using it a few quarters back due to that. Community and Enterprise are becoming too disjointed.

What would be a better approach?

Developers livings as monks and coding away in a dark delapidated castle surviving on their 4 donated cups of coffee a month while addressing 43,000 GitHub issues a month created by enterprise users who are working on commodifying the FOSS product into their cloud solution.
Post reply on HN