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Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

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Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#91

Post by YourDadVPN »

commiepatrol wrote: post #49
cs702 wrote: post #9

"Excessive speed" and "alcohol intoxication" -- two common causes of human driver failure. Other causes of human driver failure include driving while tired or exhausted, falling asleep at the wheel, driving while angry or upset, getting bored while driving, using the car's infotainment system while driving, using a mobile phone while driving, getting distracted by passengers, smoking pot while driving, being a reckle…

We already have self driving that works and it's called a train. Instead of dumping money into self driving we should improve infrastructure and motivate more people to take trains.

Trains somehow manage to be more expensive than cars, even in countries that subsidise them, despite having massively more throughput. Until that problem is solved I don't see people choosing them over cars.

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#92

Post by diebeforei485 »

> the car accelerated from 39 mph to a top speed of 67 mph 2 seconds before the final tree impact, which occurred at about 57 mph. The application of the accelerator pedal ranged from 8% to 98% during the 5 seconds of recorded data, and there was no evidence of braking.

My hot take is that it shouldn't be possible to accelerate that quickly unless you actually apply the pedal to 100%.

Also, I think the accelerator and brake pedals should have a different feel. Maybe they should be made of different materials so there is clear tactile feedback.

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#94

Post by Symbiote »

brewdad wrote: post #59
climb_stealth wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds pretty terrifying in an emergency situation. What is the reason for the rear doors working differently? I can't picture someone referring to their user manual or looking under the seat to open the door when the car is on fire. This reads like a terrible design.

Child safety locks will prevent the rear doors from being opened from the inside, even when unlocked. Perhaps they were engaged either intentionally or by default?

This isn't the child lock. The rear doors have some sort of electronic lock, so if the power fails you have to use the mechanical release which is hidden under the carpet or something.

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#95

Post by statop »

ajross wrote: post #90
haliskerbas wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My favorite one is when you’re stopped at a red light in a Tesla, and the on screen display shows the stationary cars and features around you bouncing around. If that’s what it sees when it’s still, idk how to trust it when it’s moving.

It's just so amazingly frustrating to have these discussions where people get so close to understanding and then willfully turn away. I mean, try this yourself! Pull up to a stop light, close your eyes, and recite the distances to and orientations of the nearest five or six vehicles. Now read it off the screen. Think you'll beat the car? Really? In fact, no, it's quite clear that the car, with 360 degrees of camera c…

That isn't how humans work. In any case, most humans are capable of FSD. Your Tesla isn't. No one cares about 360 degree 30Hz cameras. Just like two eyes aren't the solution to driving. Lots of animals have two eyes, most of them won't ever drive a vehicle.

Other commenter "My coworker gave me a ride in his Tesla ... FSD tried to cross over into the opposing lanes, ran a red, narrowly avoided hitting a cyclist"

Your reply "Huh. FSD (Mine) took my kid to diving practice this afternoon. Weird world. Just please stop with the hate."

I'm not sure what you hope to prove by replying to anecdotes about unacceptable autopilot with anecdotes about acceptable autopilot? It doesn't mean everyone else is a hater any more than you're a shill. It just means autopilot performance across hardware and environmental factors is not within the envelope it needs to be.

Maybe try replacing "FSD" in these comments with the names of two fictional friends.

"Steve tried to cross over into the opposing lanes, ran a red, narrowly avoided hitting a cyclist"

"Huh. Rick took my kid to diving practice this afternoon. Weird world. Just please stop with the hate."

Should we trust Steve because Rick is a good driver?

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#96

Post by adriancr »

brewdad wrote: post #64
sowbug wrote: post #2

This was the one where the media reported that because nobody was found in the front seat it must have been the fault of the self-driving feature. The NTSB found that none of the driver-assistance features were activated, and the driver was probably tossed into the backseat from the impact: Although the driver’s seat was found vacant and the driver was found in the left rear seat, the available evidence suggests that…

I'm confused by this description. Are they saying the impact caused the driver to be ejected from the front seat to the rear? I'm not sure physics works that way. Are they saying the driver left the front seat and climbed into the rear so that he could blame autopilot when the police arrived on scene?

I've been in a crash as passenger in front.

It's surprising how fast I got out of the car via back seats without even thinking.

(only thought was - door on my side is potentially blocked, get out...)

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#97

Post by palata »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #60
palata wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you own a car, you don't want to wait 20min before it's ready for you. You want to bring it in remote places where it will stay so that you won't have to wait 2h for it to come back. And you want to leave your stuff in it. If you are ready to wait for a car to come pick you up, or to plan your trip based on the schedule of the car, and to pack your stuff in one bag that you can carry along... ... then, my friend…

The wait for an Uber is typically much smaller than the walk to the transit station + wait there (I don't think I've ever waited 20 min), you aren't restricted to one bag, and there is no schedule. The wait would get even smaller if there were 10x as many cars participating on that platform. Car sharing is inconvenient because you first have to get to the station. Public transport often doesn't take you where you act…

I guess it depends a lot on the quality of your public transport.

Where I come from (not the US), in cities you have a bus/tram/metro every 5-10 minutes, bringing you everywhere, for a fraction of the cost of an Uber (which is why nobody uses Uber).

Places that don't have good public transport are quite remote, usually there are no Uber there, and if there is a taxi service it is quite far away so you have to wait and it's expensive.

Finally, moving one person at a time in a big heavy vehicle is less energy-efficient than having them in public transport (or better: taking the bike!). So public transport + bike again wins there, I think.

But again, it depends on the quality of your public service.

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#98

Post by palata »

brewdad wrote: post #55
palata wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you own a car, you don't want to wait 20min before it's ready for you. You want to bring it in remote places where it will stay so that you won't have to wait 2h for it to come back. And you want to leave your stuff in it. If you are ready to wait for a car to come pick you up, or to plan your trip based on the schedule of the car, and to pack your stuff in one bag that you can carry along... ... then, my friend…

Much like car sharing today, you'll have the option to keep the car at a remote trailhead or whatever, so it will be there in 2 hours. You'll just have to continue paying for it. Otherwise, you can end your ride and take your chances that it will still be there when you get back. In areas outside the "home" area, you'll have no choice but to keep paying since you can't "return" the car there. People that live in citi…

> People that live in cities, where this is most likely to catch on earlier

in cities where the public transport sucks, you mean? I just don't understand who would ever want to use a car inside Paris or Amsterdam, for instance.

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#99

Post by wkat4242 »

haliskerbas wrote: post #89
gamblor956 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's truly bizarre that you are blaming the humans for the poor self driving by the car . My coworker gave me a ride in his Tesla 2 months ago, on the roads near SpaceX's facility in SoCal. During the 15 minute ride FSD tried to cross over into the opposing lanes, ran a red, narrowly avoided hitting a cyclist (because the cyclist swerved away to save his life) and failed to recognize half of the cars on the road with…

My favorite one is when you’re stopped at a red light in a Tesla, and the on screen display shows the stationary cars and features around you bouncing around. If that’s what it sees when it’s still, idk how to trust it when it’s moving.

I was recently in a Tesla taxi (not in FSD mode) and I was surprised how badly the detection works. It would recognize pedestrians as roadside bins, then change its mind. Scooters and push bikes would just pop up and disappear etc. Seems to me a lot more sensor fusion work is needed to make this reliable.

Re: Cause of Fatal 2021 Tesla Wreck Was “Excessive Speed” and “Alcohol Intoxication”

#100

Post by wkat4242 »

jcranmer wrote: post #68
epgui wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you own a car, you typically only use it a small percentage of the day (it certainly is true of the average owner). When you're offering a ride service, that one car is being utilized a much higher proportion of the day. Ignoring the driver, taxi/ride-hail/autonomous-ride services are much more efficient uses of a vehicle over time. (And this is just a side note, but obviously if you don't have to pay for a huma…

I think you're missing another important aspect of car usage: demand is quite bursty. A substantial portion of the workforce works 9-5 jobs, and that means that the chief demand is shuttling people to their jobs at the same time. A fleet sized to carry that demand is going to have poor utilization for the rest of the day--no better than 50%, and probably somewhat below 25%--simply because there's nothing for those ca…

That's not bad. Those cars still need to be charged, maintained etc
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