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Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

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Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#91

Post by nine_k »

porcoda wrote: post #4

This is why I still buy music I like - either physical media, or DRM-free files I can archive away. It's more expensive and labor intensive to manage, but at least I don't have to worry about my music ever vanishing for one reason or another. Things like Spotify are useful for discovering new stuff, but I sort of like knowing that stuff I like will always be available for me to enjoy regardless of what's going on amo…

I'm always sad when I can't find on Bandcamp a band I just heard on Youtube. I'd just pay them outright, with rather few intermediate layers, and no DRM.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#92

Post by kzrdude »

anderber wrote: post #53

My biggest issue is that Spotify is prioritizing podcasts over music, and I'm not paying them for podcasts. I decided to switch to Tidal as they pay artists a much more fair share and focus on the music.

I'm just annoyed that

Spotify is showing a podcast UI in the app, even though I'm not interested.

Spotify is trying to corner podcasts which is a thriving, free, relatively decentralized ecosystem.

(I cancelled my spotify when the 2021 rewind showed how little I use it)

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#93

Post by pseudalopex »

systemvoltage wrote: post #78
mulmen wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Young and Mitchell pulling their music is literally freedom of speech (free expression). Neil Young can do whatever he wants with his content (speech), just like Rogan. This is competition in the free marketplace of ideas. You're absolutely entitled to your opinion on these actions and you're free to support Spotify or Young or Mitchell or any combination of the three. But there is no "freedom of speech" side here.

> Young and Mitchell pulling their music is literally freedom of speech (free expression). Yes, they can protest. But they can't demand to shut up others (Rogan) which is what they seem to be doing. Personally, people should double down on their protest, hope others join against Joe Rogan's batshit insane science. But, I will never stand behind people wanting to deny him the exact rights they're exercising. Young and…

What evidence is there Young or Mitchell would deny Rogan the right to pull his podcast from any platform with their music?

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#94

Post by gnabgib »

Several versions of this post already:

Joni Mitchell Joining Neil Young in Protest over Spotify (apnews), 11pts, 8 comments[0], 8 hours ago

Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young's Spotify protest over anti-vax content (theguardian), 7pts, 5 comments[1], 8 hours ago

Joni Mitchell says she will follow Neil Young by removing her music from Spotify (cnn), 46pts, 72 comments[2], 10 hours ago

Joni Mitchell wants songs off Spotify in Covid row (bbc) 3pts, 0 comments[3], 18 hours ago

Joni Mitchell Says She’s Removing Her Music from Spotify(pitchfork) 1pt, 0 comments[4], 19 hours ago

Joni Mitchell pulling music from Spotify in solidarity with Neil Young (thedenverchannel?), 42pts, 84 comments[b], 21 hours ago

  [0]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30128604
  [1]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30128437
  [2]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30127232
  [3]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30124600
  [4]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30124292
  [b]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30123710

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#95

Post by ipaddr »

unfocussed_mike wrote: post #34
olivierestsage wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't actually mention free speech in my comment, which (although I do passionately believe in it!) I don't consider the main issue here. If a precedent is set for artists being rewarded for demanding that other artists be removed from platforms, where will it end? How will the line be drawn? How much content will the people listening on these platforms be deprived of simply because of rivalries and the like? It d…

In what sense are Mitchell and Young being _rewarded_? They're going to lose some money, right? And they've certainly lost a few Joe Rogan fans. Both of them simply asserted their right not to share a platform with someone they believe is doing significant harm. They owe him and their (Spotify's) customers nothing in particular. It'll either work out for them and they'll get what they want, or it won't.

He makes 600,000 a month from his own streaming service. Some protests are commercials.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#96

Post by subpixel »

eej71 wrote: post #17
least wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why shouldn’t this behavior be tolerated? This is the response that they uniquely can make to protest for what they believe in. I do not condone censorship and I’m more concerned about the surgeon general suggesting that Spotify should censor Joe Rogan but these actions are also falling in the lines of free expression, which should be protected.

He certainly has a right to do that. No doubt I wonder if Mr. Young will apply the same moral stringency to the rest of his distributors. I also wonder if his fans are aware of his own unscientific misinformation campaigns in regards to GMO foods. I think most wonder - where does it end? What heterodox positions are tolerated and which ones aren’t? Especially in the context of something like a broad based music distr…

Neil Young has, as far as I’m aware, made a point of arguing against GMO policy, not science. He’s anti-corporate, greed and an environmentalist, and Monsanto and glysophate are credible threats to farmers and the environment, respectively.

I know less about the plight of farmers being forced to use GM seed, but I am intimately familiar with the decimation of insect life in the last decade.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#97

Post by johnchristopher »

woodruffw wrote: post #41
gonehome wrote: post #26

Based on the recent Stratechery Neil Young advocates against GMOs which is the “anti-science” position on that issue. I think independent of my views on Rogan personally this kind of ultimatum to silence someone is just wrong. The free speech position is the principled one. Spotify wouldn’t be in this position if they weren’t trying to aggregate podcast ownership and ruin the open ecosystem anyway. Still, if I were S…

My understanding of the GMO debate is that there are two kinds of GMO development: there's GMO for the purposes of making crops themselves hardier, more nutritious, etc., and then there's GMO for the purposes of making crops more resistant to novel pesticides, herbicides, etc. The agricultural industry likes to conflate the two, since the latter is much harder to defend. I have no idea what Neil Young actually believ…

Isn' t there another kind of GMO whose sole purpose is IP so farmers can' t reuse seeds from one season to the next ?

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#98

Post by tomcat27 »

woodruffw wrote: post #50
torstenvl wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps you didn't know, but Neil Young tried to get Spotify to deplatform Joe Rogan (i.e., to cancel his Spotify distribution deal), and used his repertoire as an ultimatum. EDIT: I'm being downvoted to oblivion for stating an objective fact. This is unbecoming of HN. I'm out.

The linguistic choice of "deplatform[ing]" is such a funny one: in any other era, we'd call withholding one's business a "boycott." But the history of the word "boycott" in the US has a distinctly anti-racial hue, and people who yammer about deplatforming seem to take extreme pains to avoid any comparison between today's boycotts and those good old lunch counters.

AFAIK boycott is temporary but de-platforming is permanent. -- closing a contract.

Re: Joni Mitchell joins Neil Young in protest against Spotify

#100

Post by pseudalopex »

gonehome wrote: post #90
pseudalopex wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It wasn't an ultimatum. Young directed his management to pull his music and explained why.

"I am doing this because Spotify is spreading fake information about vaccines – potentially causing death to those who believe the disinformation being spread by them ... They can have Rogan or Young. Not both." I read this as if you want me get rid of him, but I’ll paste it here for clarity. Others may see it differently.

You left out the important part. "I want you to let Spotify know immediately TODAY that I want all my music off their platform". Probably he would reconsider if they dropped Rogan. He didn't expect it or ask.
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