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Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

hongkongwatch.org

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Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#91

Post by butMaga88 »

thepasswordis wrote: post #56

How do people seriously not see the parallels here? The way that the CCP, and most Chinese people, view the protestors in Hong Kong, is exactly the same way that the US Government, as well as most of the US, view the protestors in DC on Weds. HKers say they want democracy and fair elections. CCP and most Chinese think that's bullshit. MAGAs say they want democracy and fair elections. Most of the US Gov as well as mos…

Prove that MAGA supporters did not just get a free and fair election and simply lost.

The GOP has a gerrymandered mathematical advantage and still lost.

At what point to the unaligned and left leaning folks, who won by majority vote, get to have their voice heard?

When did evidence become optional?

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#92

Post by ceilingcorner »

baybal2 wrote: post #75
ceilingcorner wrote: post #43

The situation in HK is depressing, especially when Western corporations and politicians seem to admire the CCP more than democratic activists. What can an individual do to help Hong Kongers? Any suggestions?

> What can an individual do to help Hong Kongers? Any suggestions? How many firearms, and ammo you can buy, and how many politicians you can lobby? Even if you are a single digit millionaire, that's just enough to arm, and feed no more than a single lightly armed battalion for a few months. I see other option than a military solution, either limited, or not. Even if any Western power decide on half hearted piecemeal…

Not quite what I had in mind. Thinking more like: support relocation plans for Hong Kongers, nonprofits to donate to, etc.

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#93

Post by loceng »

Ekaros wrote: post #66
arcticbull wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s not how international obligations work. Most borders were defined at gunpoint but we generally don’t allow for arbitrary redefinition when the loser gets uppity, Crimea aside.

Then again, if the old loser is the new winner. They get to define the rules...

They've not won anything though, in fact they showed their hand to the world to wake us up, and sooner than later there will be a multi-lateral trade agreement between Democracies that will reduce the CCP's economic power - and India who' aligned with, allied with Democracies are readying to replace any economic activity in China. This isn't a war they can win.

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#94

Post by abc-xyz »

ceilingcorner wrote: post #43

The situation in HK is depressing, especially when Western corporations and politicians seem to admire the CCP more than democratic activists. What can an individual do to help Hong Kongers? Any suggestions?

Boycott everything Made in China (I’ve been doing it for years, and it’s not that difficult.. I mean if you can find alternative for 9 out of 10 goods then it’s of course still a big win). Similarly, boycott companies that kowtow to China (you can probably save a lot of money by doing so, e.g. by pirating all Disney movies/tv series instead of going to the cinema/paying for Disney+).

Support companies that voice support for those oppressed by the CCP (such as ProtonVPN, Notepad++).

Vote for politicians that are not afraid to stand up to CCP (I for instance voted for Trump despite having my political views mostly align with Sanders - solely due to his anti-China stance.. you can of course also argue that his administration has singlehandedly done more to stand up to China than the rest of the world combined in the past couple decades).

Spread awareness of China’s atrocities. If more people realized that CCP are even more evil and dangerous than Nazi Germany then we’d likely see more aggressive policies towards China (such as banning their companies from our markets, keeping the tariffs (Biden said he’d end them) - hopefully with other countries similarly implementing tariffs).

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#95

Post by CogitoCogito »

thepasswordis wrote: post #64
CogitoCogito wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know and it's scary. That doesn't mean an attack will actually happen though. And even if it does happen, that doesn't mean it'll succeed.

What downside does China have? Nobody will stand up and do anything to stop them.

What downsides? Even ignoring the economic and political fallout (which could leave them entirely isolated on the world stage), they could _fail_ in their attempted invasion even if only going head to head with Taiwan. The result after both a successful and an unsuccessful invasion could very well be a collapse of the PRC. They certainly understand this. That's way they've simply used the threats as a tool of internal propaganda. They may one day go for it, but it is very far from risk-free.

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#96

Post by ceejayoz »

thepasswordis wrote: post #85
ceejayoz wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The poster alleges the US Government opposes the DC protesters in the same way the CCP opposes the HK ones. That requires not considering the US President to be part of the US Government for it to be true.

The US president has said that he will use the full power of the government to track down and prosecute everybody involved in the capitol riot. I'd link you to the video of him saying this, but Twitter deleted it so I can't.

Sure, and the blinky Vietnam POWs talking about their wonderful humane treatment just had a bunch of dust in their eyes.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/08/us/politics/democrats-tru...

> Behind closed doors, he made clear that he would not resign and expressed regret about releasing a video on Thursday committing to a peaceful transition of power and condemning the violence at the Capitol that he had egged on a day before.

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#97

Post by loceng »

ceilingcorner wrote: post #70
Leary wrote: post #27

These Hong Kong supporters are a true inspiration for Americans. Their occupation of the legislature shows what a free people could do against oppression

I remember seeing them waving American flags during protests, presumably as a reference to liberty. I thought, “I wish we lived up to their perceptions of us.”

Of course the CCP used those photos as propaganda to reenforce the arguably false narrative presented to mainland Chinese that the CIA was behind the resistance. The psychological aspect of warfare never ceases to amaze me.

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#98

Post by z5h »

minikites wrote: post #79
tinza123 wrote: post #59

Enough of these political posts on HN. If I want to see them I would head to r/news or NY Times. Strongly opinionated conclusion supported by piecemeal information aiming to inspire meaningless online battles with strangers? No thanks.

Everything is political. If you don't think so, it means you're protected by at least some kind of privilege. Rather than denying that, think about what advantages you have in your life that insulate you from the struggles of other people.

Everything is A LITTLE BIT political. And we reserve the right on when to focus on the political or non political aspect. My pancake breakfast has ties to unions, lobbyists, international trade. Guess what, I’m just going to eat my pancakes.

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#99

Post by butMaga88 »

thepasswordis wrote: post #67
ceejayoz wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The way that the CCP, and most Chinese people, view the protestors in Hong Kong, is exactly the same way that the US Government, as well as most of the US, view the protestors in DC on Weds. We're not counting the President of the United States as part of the US Government?

Is this a joke? Trump is the most anti-CCP president in the last 40 years. Please watch this Pompeo speech if you want to know how the Trump admin feels towards China: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7azj-t0gtPM

Meanwhile his former transportation secretary’s sister is married to Xi. Elaine was briefly in trouble with the media for inviting family to government meetings.

But despite the mass media being a known political collaborator, let’s merely take the content you cherry picked at face value.

Power is in bed with power. Trying to paint one side or another as above that, ignoring facts of biology for political rhetoric is putting your head in the sand.

Re: Arrests of Hong Kong democrats shows why EU must reject China investment

#100

Post by baybal2 »

mantap wrote: post #13

The west needs to sanction China. This is violation of China's treaty obligations, it's not just a domestic issue, it's an international law issue, and it should have international consequences.

> The west needs to sanction China.

Do you understand that the West mostly sanctions itself when it tries to sanction a country which:

1. Has surreal trade surplus with it.

2. Supports nearly entire consumer spending part of your economy.

3. Provides most of your light industry goods.

4. Buys a big chunk of your debt.

This is why I was saying that China can easily do a blunder, after a blunder, and still outmatch the West economically, and you need something other than simply sanctions.

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