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FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

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Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#91

Post by ardy42 »

jaywalk wrote: post #51
Ericson2314 wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If taxation is theft, so are the vast majority of jobs.

I have a choice of jobs, including working for myself. I have no choice in paying taxes.

> I have a choice of jobs, including working for myself. I have no choice in paying taxes.

You totally do have choice to not pay your taxes, just like you have a choice to not pay your rent or mortgage or renege on other kinds of private contracts. The making those choices may lead to outcomes that aren't good for you, but it doesn't mean you have no choice.

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#92

Post by vonmoltke »

Macha wrote: post #85
vonmoltke wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not set by the employee, rather the employer looks at expected income for the year and withholds accordingly. At the end of the financial year, the Tax dept. does a final calculation and if the amount was too high/low, they send you a notice. That's my question, how does an employer or taxing authority know what that amount is? My employer doesn't know my withholding status until I tell them via a W-4, and tha…

Withholding = (Taxable income in each bracket * tax rate for each bracket) - (annual tax credits / number of annual payments from your employer). If you're married and want to be taxed as a couple, you simply send the documentation as such to the tax office after your wedding. You can tell your employer and they'll try adjust appropriately in payroll, or you can not tell them and the government will send you a tax re…

> If you're married and want to be taxed as a couple, you simply send the documentation as such to the tax office after your wedding.

So that's one difference. I have never sent the IRS proof of our marriage, and they have never requested it. I simply updated my wife's name and our filing status in the year we got married.

> (Taxable income in each bracket * tax rate for each bracket) - (annual tax credits / number of annual payments from your employer)

> You can tell your employer and they'll try adjust appropriately in payroll, or you can not tell them and the government will send you a tax refund at the end of the year for the partner with the higher tax bracket.

I'm confused by this. Are tax brackets always individual in Ireland? The reason I need to specify additional withholding is because each of our income withholding calculations starts from the lowest bracket and tops out at a bracket below our actual top marginal rate, which is determined by adding our incomes.

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#93

Post by areyousure »

ciarannolan wrote: post #55
rayiner wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Consider that your opinion on what is "universally hated" is mostly shaped by the sources of information that you consume. Yours happens to be wrong. Overall the country views ObamaCare ~50% favorably, with some specific parts close to 90% approval I support the ACA, but when you implement the benefits in a law and repeal or ignore most of the new taxes and mandates, that will happen.

I thought just the individual mandate was struck down by the SCOTUS. What other pieces make up most of the new taxes and mandates that were repealed or ignored?

The individual mandate was upheld by the SCOTUS in 2012: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Federation_of_Indepen...

Rather, the individual mandate was zeroed out in 2017: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_Cuts_and_Jobs_Act_of_2017

The Cadillac tax has been delayed, seemingly indefinitely: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadillac_insurance_plan

The employer mandate was delayed.

The Independent Payment Advisory Board was canceled: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_Payment_Advisory_B...

The nutrition labeling requirements were delayed from 2010 to 2018.

There are many other more technical provisions that have been delayed as well. It is easy to find many relevant sources online, though it's hard to keep them up to date because many delays just continue! https://cgsnet.org/ckfinder/userfiles/files/ACA_Delays_at_a_...

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#94

Post by Izkata »

briandear wrote: post #2

Not sure I understand the hate for TurboTax. Literally not a single person is forced to use it. I do use it and it's a very good product for the most part. Perhaps energy should be directed at the actual tax code complexity rather than software built to help navigate filing. Ted Cruz's tax plan would have practically eliminated the need for TurboTax-type software. https://taxfoundation.org/details-and-analysis-senato…

> Perhaps energy should be directed at the actual tax code complexity rather than software built to help navigate filing.

Two years ago the paper form for standard federal 1040 was cut to about 1/4th its previous length. It's happening, just slowly.

(Yes, I still use the paper forms yearly for both federal and state. I've never seen any software as necessary for filing taxes...)

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#95

Post by Cactus2018 »

c22 wrote: post #88
klmadfejno wrote: post #50

God I hope this suit is successful. Lots of people here are discussing the regulatory trap they've got, and that's a big problem. But the actual problem mentioned in the suit is deceptive marketing. TurboTax is the worst in this regard. Last year, I, at every step of the process, declined the expensive options that say "maybe you'll save more money if you permanently switch into this paid mode". Yet after a couple ho…

This happened to me too. I just printed out the return they generated and mailed it in myself. This is actually how tax preparation software used to always work and it definitely wasn't free back then.

This year I was unable to get to the print-out without paying

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#96

Post by OJFord »

supernova87a wrote: post #72

Why are we bothering with the small potatoes in the room (TurboTax not putting URLs to free tax filing, etc. etc) when the elephant is: "Why isn't the IRS giving people a way to prepopulate and file taxes for free with the financial info that the IRS already has on everyone?" Well, I suppose it's just a product of the corporate interests and congressional deadlock that prevents us from doing a multitude of things rig…

Or just taxing at source for the common things, so that 'filling taxes' isn't something most people have to do.

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#97

Post by ardy42 »

jaywalk wrote: post #23
toomuchtodo wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because some people are irrationally biased against government providing services or collecting taxes in general. These are ingrained belief systems being challenged.

Ridiculous thing to say. I am a small government person, and I believe taxation is theft. However, I am a realist and so I recognize that taxes are part of our reality. I am 100% in favor of the IRS making it as easy as possible for people to do their taxes, because they already have 99% of the info needed.

> and I believe taxation is theft

Money, taxes, and the crime of theft are all creatures of the law. Taxes aren't theft because that would be a literal contradiction. Taxes are just part of the rules about how money operates.

I should also note that 1) the law isn't just what some individual or other feels is natural, 2) I'd imagine that primitive law that defines theft also defines obligations to the community (which are analogous to taxes).

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#98

Post by karlp »

jaywalk wrote: post #23
toomuchtodo wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because some people are irrationally biased against government providing services or collecting taxes in general. These are ingrained belief systems being challenged.

Ridiculous thing to say. I am a small government person, and I believe taxation is theft. However, I am a realist and so I recognize that taxes are part of our reality. I am 100% in favor of the IRS making it as easy as possible for people to do their taxes, because they already have 99% of the info needed.

What's the point of your belief if you know it can't happen?

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#99

Post by rayiner »

freeone3000 wrote: post #27
rayiner wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Consider that your opinion on what is "universally hated" is mostly shaped by the sources of information that you consume. Yours happens to be wrong. Overall the country views ObamaCare ~50% favorably, with some specific parts close to 90% approval I support the ACA, but when you implement the benefits in a law and repeal or ignore most of the new taxes and mandates, that will happen.

Okay? There's no reason laws have to have good and bad parts, like a fundamental yin-yang. You can simply write laws without the bad parts.

There is, because we live in a finite world. Everything is about trade-offs. In the case of ACA, it’s benefits on one hand, and the taxes (and the mandate) that pay for those benefits on the other hand.

Re: FTC Is Investigating Intuit over TurboTax Practices

#100

Post by Macha »

vonmoltke wrote: post #92
Macha wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Withholding = (Taxable income in each bracket * tax rate for each bracket) - (annual tax credits / number of annual payments from your employer). If you're married and want to be taxed as a couple, you simply send the documentation as such to the tax office after your wedding. You can tell your employer and they'll try adjust appropriately in payroll, or you can not tell them and the government will send you a tax re…

> If you're married and want to be taxed as a couple, you simply send the documentation as such to the tax office after your wedding. So that's one difference. I have never sent the IRS proof of our marriage, and they have never requested it. I simply updated my wife's name and our filing status in the year we got married. > (Taxable income in each bracket * tax rate for each bracket) - (annual tax credits / number o…

So let's simplify the numbers a bit compared to the actual system:

The tax rates for a single person will be:

30000 @ 20%

remainder @ 50%

You earn 40000. Your spouse earns 20000.

Example 1:

You are taxed seperately. Your employer takes 11000 of your gross and sends it to the government. Your spouse's employer takes 4000 of their gross and sends it to the government. Your total tax payment is 15000.

Example 2:

You opt in to join taxation. Your employers have no idea you are married, but the tax office does (because you sent them documentation to opt in for joint taxation). The government then assesses your tax as a couple and realises your joint income falls into the lower tax bound, and your tax should only be 12000, but you paid 15000. You get a refund of 3000.

Example 3:

Same as above, but you tell your employer. You can add up to min(26300, spouse's income) to your standard rate tax bracket. Your spouse needs to inform their employer to deduct the same from theirs. You tell your employer you are transferring 10000 from your spouse's tax bracket to yours.

Your employer's payroll now works out your tax as 40000 * 20% = 8000. Your spouse's employer works out their tax as 20000 * 20% = 4000. You pay 12000 exactly.

Example 4:

Same as above, but only one of you informed your employer, you committed tax fraud, your employer filled out the form wrong, whatever. You get a tax bill for however much under your tax liability as a pair that your combined tax payments were.

Example 5:

Your income is 25000, your spouse's income is 25000. Regardless of whether you are assessed individually or seperately, your tax is 10000. Your employers deduct 5000 each.

Of course, there's various tax credits you can apply for and you can inform your employer to deduct them from your payments or apply for them at end of year from the government. These can only decrease your tax bill, not increase it, so I'm not sure how you'd end up with an unexpected bill. There's also a higher base standard rate for married person to compensate for not being able to completely share your tax bands for the year (a measure intended to gain some extra tax income from couples with one high earning person and one person with a very small income, I guess).

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