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The Clean Network – United States Department of State

state.gov

91–100 of 412 posts

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#91
post #40

What is a better way to prevent mass IP theft the CCP is doing?

Simple, stop outsourcing manufacturing to China. Companies regularly get contracts which require an IP transfer in return for cheap mass labor. Of course there's IP which is stolen, but that's the cost of doing business when manufacturing at home has been shuttered.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#92
post #20

In case it's not obvious after you read the text in that page, the word "Clean" in the context of that text actually means: * balkanized/siloed instead of globally standardized; * permissioned instead of permissionless; and * monitored via backdoors instead of optionally secure. I'm reminded of this passage from George Orwell's classic piece, "Politics and the English Language" ( http://www.public-library.uk/ebooks/7…

I am not sure why you got downvoted. This is absolutely the interpretation you can easily reach after reading it. Maybe readers perceive Orwell reference as too dramatic?

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#93
post #16

Has anyone published the evidence of Huawei being an "arm of the PRC surveillance state"? I've seen a lot of claims and a lot of out-of-court-settled lawsuits, but nothing really showing that they're using their devices or software infrastructure for surveillance.

Corporations are inherently organs of government, being incorporated under a specific jurisdiction and receiving liability limitations in return. At the very least, Huawei is an arm of the PRC surveillance state in the same way that Google is an arm of the USG surveillance state.

The problem is not that the claim is false, but rather the one-sided focus on it that justifies the USG surveillance state continuing to turn on its own people. If this were just some defense contractor pork for internal USG networks nobody would really care, but it sounds like they intend to fork most common Internet features while dictating how they operate.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#94

The intention of cutting out bad actors seems to be in the right place, but using "Clean" for the terminology is really unnecessarily inflammatory.

I think the current administration has seen major success, in part by being inflammatory and is just trying to keep up the publicity.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#95

Why the hell does any of this have to be China specific? Tomorrow the bugbear could be anyone else Like, we want clean networks free of foreign influence and sruveillance, full stop. Or are they implying that Five Eyes surveillance is good and OK?

This is more about Huawei in general. Russia, for instance, doesn't have a technology provider of similar magnitude and influence.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#96
post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an unsupported assertion. We have no specific data to suggest that this would happen.

I mean, I know that with less than 90 days before one of the largest absentee voting elections in the history of the nation that I would fire 23 USPS administrators on a Friday evening several days after admitting to congress to slowing down mail delivery. That seems reasonable. Right? https://www.forbes.com/sites/danielcassady/2020/08/06/postma... https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/08/07/postal-se...

Do administrators speed mail delivery?

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#97
I guess I'm confused. I clicked the link and read through it really quick. I didn't really have a lot of strong opinions. This seems to be a response to how powerful China is becoming and that's scary for many reasons. This almost seems like a natural reaction of one government trying to abuse the internet and another government trying to protect it's citizens. It might even be irresponsible for the U.S. not to react. Obviously, there's no mention of Russia, but let's shelve that for now.

I wasn't totally alarmed by what I read. Maybe I'm misunderstanding something, but I take this as a sort of stamp of approval that a cloud/network/platform isn't compromised by China. It doesn't seem to say, "Only use the U.S. internet" as other commenters have mentioned. The stamp of approval seems to be global (if you look at the list that was mentioned it's worldwide, not just the US).

When I came back to look at the comments I was surprised to see a lot of noise. I feel like something must have flew over my head and maybe someone can explain it to me. I went ahead and read the link again but slower and I still don't understand the reaction I'm seeing on HN.

Maybe it's some sort of state of idealism. People want the internet to be a place that's free from tyranny or government, but that's not what's happening. China/Russia/US/whoever is abusing the internet to gain an upper-hand. The best solution is to reinvent the internet, which I know there are a quite a few projects going on that are trying to accomplish that, but in the meantime what is a government supposed to do? Let other governments siphon their citizen's data without a cost?

Again, I could use an explanation as I must have missed something that a lot of other people are finding very obvious. When a top level comment just says "Make sure you vote in November". I don't understand the context.

Disclaimer: I am definitely not voting for Trump and dislike pretty much everything the administration has done. Yet, I do try to look at everything in silos.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#98
post #90
post #80

I have the same feeling about this as I did the announcement of the "Department of Homeland Security". The name sounded Soviet in origin, with only the exchange of "Homeland" in place of "Motherland". It reminded me of things my family had taught me didn't happen in the United States. "We call on all freedom-loving nations and companies to join the Clean Network." is a sentence straight out of an authoritarian playbo…

> Furthermore, State is a decade or more behind the game. It is my impression that modern companies that care about security assume that all networks are compromised and act accordingly. Unfortunately far from true. There's a small percentage who have the resource to run this kind of ops. Don't look at FAANG on how security is in companies, they're outliers by far.

State's 2020 budget is $52B. It has direct-collaboration access to DOD and NIST.

We should expect our national-security infrastructure to be more resilient than commercial infrastructure, not less.

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#99
post #45
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is some https://www.forbes.com/sites/zakdoffman/2019/04/25/huawei-xi...

Is it referencing something specific? It's an editorial referencing other editorials. Is there something direct like PRISM type wikileaks? Considering the NSA hacked and had backdoors in Huawei servers for almost a decade, I imagine direct evidence shouldn't be difficult to produce. https://mashable.com/2014/03/22/nsa-huawei/

The NSA barely acknowledges its own existence. It's not exactly known for publishing direct intelligence for public consumption.. The Mashable report you link was only possible because of the most notorious leak in the history of the world (Edward Snowden), who is currently a fugitive of the US government.

Have you tried searching in wikileaks though?

Re: The Clean Network – United States Department of State

#100
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s such a long list of this stuff from various companies. It’s not hard to research this at all. In terms of an anecdotal evidence... My father used to work for molex, one of his biggest complaints were fixing the molds after they were sent to Chinese factories. They would try to deconstruct them and couldn’t put them back together (this was the 90’s, early 2000’s). So they would be shipped back to the US operat…

This has been known for decades, companies knew, and the way they dealt with this was to only give China obsolete tech or tech about to get out of date, so they didn't care. That's no longer the case as China is catching up fast and really threatening the competitive advantage of truly innovative companies all around the world.

I think part of it is moving most manufacturing to China had companies like Molex move as well (cheaper). Molex builds the molds for items (I’m sure other companies are doing this to). That means the Chinese are reviving the designs BEFORE manufacturing even starts (US or China or India).

My understanding from the tool & die industry is that’s only been happening the last decade or so. IMO that’s the real issue, because it’s decimating the ability to manufacture here and sure design can happen in the US, but if you can’t build the molds for the latest tech here then it doesn’t matter. Those designs are given straight to China, no need to reverse engineer.

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