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Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

andreagrandi.it

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Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#91

Post by thaumasiotes »

jacquesm wrote: post #58
kick wrote: post #5

I feel like people don't accept that Google needs the EU less than the EU needs Google. If Google were to pull out of the EU overnight, there'd be death as a result. If the EU were to kick Google out, there might still be deaths, but none of them Google employees, and in the end it wouldn't substantially impact Google. There's no real incentive for Google to be a good actor: they have all of the leverage, and if the…

> I feel like people don't accept that Google needs the EU less than the EU needs Google. It is this sort of reasoning that will get Google slapped around. The whole idea that some corporation's interests or might trumps that of a continent with 300+ million people and a very substantial part of the world economy and Google's income is, frankly, ridiculous.

> a continent with 300+ million people

This would be a pretty pitiful continent. (I'm looking at you, Australia.) Europe has more than 700 million people.

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#92

Post by Normal_gaussian »

It is not illegal at all.

At all.

Firstly lets establish the rules using the ICO's (the UK's Data Authority) handy FAQ [1], a site providing a copy of the GDPR [2], the EU Commissions adequacy decisions page [3], the EU's privacy shield page [4], and the dedicated site for the privacy shield's Google LLC page [5]:

In short (yes, this is my idea of short):

* We, the UK, are currently in the transition period where EU rules still apply [1 - "What happens now that the UK has a withdrawal agreement?"]. This lasts until Jan 1st 2021 [6]

* We, the UK, are currently on track to have pretty much the same rules (cynicism allowed) [1 - "Will the GDPR still apply when we leave the EU"]

* So Brexit shouldn't change the legality (more cynicism allowed)

So are Google breaking the law?

* The GDPR has a provision allowing third countries and international organisations to process data presuming. It is Article 45 [2]

* The USA has been approved for this [3]. Years ago [4].

* Google LLC is approved under Privacy Shield [5]

So, there is no indication of anything illegal going on. Yes they are segmenting the data incorrectly and messaging an italian as though they are a brit. However the change would be perfectly legal was it to be done to the whole of the EU.

I don't like it, but it is legal.

[1] https://ico.org.uk/for-organisations/data-protection-and-bre...

[2] https://gdpr.eu/article-45-adequacy-decision-personal-data-t...

[3] https://ec.europa.eu/info/law/law-topic/data-protection/inte...

[4] https://ec.europa.eu/info/law/law-topic/data-protection/inte...

[5] https://www.privacyshield.gov/participant?id=a2zt000000001L5...

[6] https://www.gov.uk/transition

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#93

Post by andreagrandi »

contingencies wrote: post #71
myrandomcomment wrote: post #29

The simple suggestion would be that Google needs to ask for your citizenship status and go from there. Not sure else how to solve that. If I am an American living in the EU for a few years does the GDPR apply to me when I live there? I am going to the EU next week for 10 days. When I access my gmail from the EU what law applies?

I have three western citizenships, one is EU, and I live across borders, usually accessing the internet via VPN from China. Google cannot possibly understand this, nor should it try to, rather it should give everyone the best protections guaranteed by law anywhere in the world and only punch holes in it for local regulations in specific jurisdictions where unavoidable. To do anything else (such as profiling for ads)…

Couldn’t they provide a way to check/edit our personal details so we can set our home address?

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#94

Post by jacquesm »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #91
jacquesm wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I feel like people don't accept that Google needs the EU less than the EU needs Google. It is this sort of reasoning that will get Google slapped around. The whole idea that some corporation's interests or might trumps that of a continent with 300+ million people and a very substantial part of the world economy and Google's income is, frankly, ridiculous.

> a continent with 300+ million people This would be a pretty pitiful continent. (I'm looking at you, Australia.) Europe has more than 700 million people.

My bad, thanks for the correction. Early onset of Alzheimer's or too little sleep. Hoping for the latter.

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#95

Post by three_seagrass »

andreagrandi wrote: post #56
three_seagrass wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you VPN'd into the UK or had activity there recently? It says on your website that you worked in London. This email is likely a courtesy notification because you had activity in the UK, a UK billing address, or something that put you there, meaning if you have activity there again, the controller will be different. What this email does not mean is that your Italy based activity is going to a different controller…

Even the article says I lived in UK/London, it's not a secret, but remains the fact I'm not a UK citizen :/ If US or EU would be the same, why mentioning brexit?

* You're receiving the email because you've had enough activity in UK to warrant a notification.

* Read literally, the email only talks about the UK, not Italy.

* If you go to the UK again, then your activity in the UK will be on a nom-GDPR handler.

There is nothing illegal here, and just because you're sitting in Italy at this moment doesn't mean Google is moving Italian activity handlers. The email is a notification about Uk only.

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#96

Post by Normal_gaussian »

andreagrandi wrote: post #84

UPDATE: I've updated the article removing the "illegal" words. Since it doesn't seem to be clear if this is legal or not from their side, I think it's right to give it the benefit of the doubt. (give CloudFlare a few minutes to update the cache, please)

Yeah this isn't illegal at all, in my other comment I expanded on it a lot more [1], but in essence the EU-US privacy shield is a thing, Google LLC is in it, and Brexit isn't really relevant.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22416701

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#97

Post by Normal_gaussian »

andreagrandi wrote: post #72

Note: if anyone thinks I should at least re-phrase the title and the article, I'm more than happy to do that. My concern is: why do they mention UK leaving EU if I'm not UK citizen? And why there is no way to appeal/complain directly with them? Mistakes can happen from anyone, but if they don't let me contact them I have no way of fixing this.

"why do they mention UK leaving EU if I'm not UK citizen?"

PR most likely. Within the UK this phrasing makes it less likely to actually be read / acted upon.

However there could be more than a few grains of truth to it as well.

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#98

Post by andreagrandi »

GordonS wrote: post #65
madeofpalk wrote: post #3

> I'm an Italian citizen, living in Italy [...] and I'm fully entitled to GDPR protection and to have my data owned by a European data controller. I don't think the latter part is true. AFAIK GDPR does not give you the right do have your data owned or processed by an EU entity. GDPR does not say that. It doesn't matter where your data is stored or processed, Google must still follow GDPR rules for data about EU resid…

No, this is not true. Companies need to be up front with you about what data they keep, and why, and they have to comply with the regs - but nowhere does it say your data has to be kept in the EU.

Why changing the data controller to Google LLC for UK users only then? (ignore the fact that they misunderstood me for a UK resident)

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#99

Post by kick »

jacquesm wrote: post #90
kick wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want Amazon and Google to get pushed out of the EU. It'd be hilarious to me, and better for the world writ large. Also, GRPC is a Google framework. Did you mean GDPR? I think the GDPR is a great thing. I think Google is bad. That doesn't change the fact that Google will continue to make substantially more money off of the EU than the measly fines they've been given by the EU so far: there's no incentive for them to…

> I want Amazon and Google to get pushed out of the EU. That won't happen. They may get fined though, until they fall in line.

I'm aware it won't happen. Wants don't always reflect plausible circumstances.

Re: Google is moving EU citizens’ data to US?

#100

Post by three_seagrass »

andreagrandi wrote: post #84

UPDATE: I've updated the article removing the "illegal" words. Since it doesn't seem to be clear if this is legal or not from their side, I think it's right to give it the benefit of the doubt. (give CloudFlare a few minutes to update the cache, please)

This isn't illegal. You worked in London and had enough UK-based activity to warrant receiving an email notification about UK-based data handlers.
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