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The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

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Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#91

I understand the 747 still gets nav updates via monthly diskettes. Most have replaced the unit with a floppy simulator that takes an SD card (or USB key?). The load takes just as long. But it doesn’t fail (forcing you to get an undamaged disk and start over). I wonder if that’s why they say they got rid of the floppy disk. Maybe they maintained the underlying tech.

Can confirm, that's how it works (for the 747).

Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#92

So when we upgrade the hardware, how much of it will be sourced from China? Is it even possible to fully secure the supply chain? Introducing any outside code or hardware is a liability. Unless there is a really urgent problem, I think they should just freeze their entire computer platform, that way they can eliminate any chance of any new threats. I can not possibly imagine any cost justification for doing so. I hav…

"The thought of some ux monkey using npm anywhere near our ICBMs makes my physically ill." Almost spilled my coffee reading this one.

Sorry Sir, we can't launch because that jerk removed left-pad from the npm registry!

Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#93
post #36

I know of several military systems that still use floppy disks, that comforts me for a few reason: * Their maintenance is well understood - every fault that is likely to happen has happened and has been recovered/repaired from. It's very unlikely there will be new surprised down the road. * Their degradation is well understood - it's been around long enough that parts have failed and have been repaired. * Isn't easil…

And the downside: you will only have a few technicians that really understand how things work, hiring new ones is next to impossible as teenagers have never seen neither the hardware nor the software that is running on it. It scales terrible to new locations. I recall a few years ago NASA was looking for 286-processors for the Space Shuttle. I cannot imagine your spacecraft is getting safer because of outdated hardwa…

Any technically competent person can get up to speed on old tech in pretty short order. Many people do it as a hobby. There's a heck of a lot less "stuff" you need to understand to work with it.

Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#94
post #36

I know of several military systems that still use floppy disks, that comforts me for a few reason: * Their maintenance is well understood - every fault that is likely to happen has happened and has been recovered/repaired from. It's very unlikely there will be new surprised down the road. * Their degradation is well understood - it's been around long enough that parts have failed and have been repaired. * Isn't easil…

And the downside: you will only have a few technicians that really understand how things work, hiring new ones is next to impossible as teenagers have never seen neither the hardware nor the software that is running on it. It scales terrible to new locations. I recall a few years ago NASA was looking for 286-processors for the Space Shuttle. I cannot imagine your spacecraft is getting safer because of outdated hardwa…

Hiring people experienced with floppies isn't harder than hiring people experienced with nuclear weapons.

Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#95

> While SACC’s hardware is decades old, its software is constantly refreshed by young Air Force programmers who learn software development skills at Offutt’s Rapid Agile Development Lab. I am not so sure I want “Rapid Agile” development for something that literally controls nuclear missiles.

Actually launching? YAGNI. We can easily implement that if it ever comes up.

As long as the potential enemies believe it is implemented, that would be ideal.

Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#97
post #52

In the 80's, I was the project engineer for the Air Force DSP satellite ground communications network upgrade. This system used a 20 MB Bernoulli Box to store the early warning messages. It was replaced in 2005. This was the system used to pass early warning to the Patriot anti-missile (Scud) batteries during the first Gulf War. Internetworking the Air Force system to an Army system was considered revolutionary in 19…

also in the 80s, when I served in the secure communications group we had a Burroughs computer that was the first generation to have not used tubes, it was the main computer for this application. Could boot by switches or paper tape.

not that the base computer for personnel and other records was much more modern, cards were still used till 89 for many applications; this was on a Sperry 1100/70 ? I remember my first turbo pascal program was used to replace a Sperry program used to upload card images to the system; we still had paper cards for some departments.

Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#99
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

`git commit -m “added factoryboy to generate random target coordinates to test the launch sequence.”` `git commit -m “Fuck fuck fuck, forgot to replace the launch API endpoint with a mock one.”` Scrum master: “Let’s implement the stuff with the highest customer value first.” Developer A: “I guess that means being able to launch the nukes.” Developer B: “Yeah. Auth can come later.” Developer C: “Nobody answered us abo…

Just set the password to 00000000 for now and we can change it later.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permissive_Action_Link#Develop...

The Kanye West method

Re: The US nuclear forces’ messaging system finally got rid of its floppy disks

#100

So when we upgrade the hardware, how much of it will be sourced from China? Is it even possible to fully secure the supply chain? Introducing any outside code or hardware is a liability. Unless there is a really urgent problem, I think they should just freeze their entire computer platform, that way they can eliminate any chance of any new threats. I can not possibly imagine any cost justification for doing so. I hav…

> So when we upgrade the hardware, how much of it will be sourced from China? FYSA[1], would it surprise you if that figure was precisely zero? [1] https://www.dmea.osd.mil/trustedic.html

That is good, but, supply chains are still a major attack vector. I think we should try to minimize that.

I am quite certain that there are no Chinese back doors in hardware that was put in the ground in the early 1980s.

Security wise, we can only go downhill from there.

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