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Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

theguardian.com

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Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#91

Post by devit »

agarden wrote: post #76

What interests me about the gun debate (if one can call it that), is that there are ways of dying that are considered acceptable risks and ways of dying that are not. If you are driving your kids across town and get t-boned by a drunk driver and everyone dies, that is considered a tragedy. But no one will advocate giving up driving. Something really bad happened, everyone move on with your lives. Or when a relative d…

Cars are used everyday by a large part of the population and are very useful and often essential for transportation.

Guns are only useful in rare cases for preventing or stopping crime, and most people don't have one or if they do they have never used it beyond practice.

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#92

Post by Loque »

anexprogrammer wrote: post #56
pjc50 wrote: post #12

Since this is today's gun argument thread, I'll just point out that the UK is currently commemorating the 20th anniversary of its first and last "mass shooting" incident, at a school in Dunblane, Scotland. The ensuing total ban on handguns and further restriction on gun licensing mean that mass shootings are nonexistant, firearm murders are extremely rare (about one per year in a country of 60m), shooting of suspects…

You forgot the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hungerford_massacre in 1987 where 16 people were killed. Both events lead to changes in firearm licensing rules, and in both cases if the existing rules had been correctly enforced, it's doubtful either person would have held a licence. EDIT: And https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumbria_shootings in 2010 10 dead, 11 injured.

It appears everything was correctly enforced? He went through the appropriate channels - filled in the correct forms, and appeared sane at the time of application.

I guess another question would be, why on earth would anyone need _any_ of those guns.

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#93

Post by jessaustin »

jamespo wrote: post #66
agarden wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, try this: far, far more people die in the US in car accidents than are shot. More people die because of DUIs than because of guns. Yet guns are endlessly highlighted as a major problem and the talk is constantly about making it harder to attain them and yet few people are ranting on about the dangers of automobile or licquor. Indeed, the original article dismisses drunk teenagers as a non-threat. Drunk teenager…

Maybe because taking away cars has more downsides than taking away guns?

Nah... fuck cars. Ride a bike!

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#94

Post by AI_Overlord »

Loque wrote: post #22
geggam wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

UK govt does kill its citizens though. Without trial. The restrictions of guns by the government ensures you have no defense from the one entity that has killed more people than anything. Their own govt. http://blogs.ft.com/david-allen-green/2015/09/08/when-does-t...

Get real. Or a tin foil hat. I am mid thirties, grown up in the UK and not having guns here is amazing. People don't get shot, as a teenager in the council flats in the UK, no-one is going to turn up with a gun, or carry a gun. And unsurprisingly, people make mistakes with guns (accidents happen). I have been forever conflicted, as I love the idea of guns, I wanted them as a kid/teenager, the idea of having such a to…

Gov gone crazy is not as unlikely as you think. It may only seem that way because of our short lifespan.

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#95

Post by misnome »

neonhomer wrote: post #61

I always hate these kind of articles. As a US citizen there's only rule when it comes to firearms and that's the 2nd Amendment: "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." Until a new Amendment is passed to revoke this individual right, all arguments are invalid.

And I'm sure that well-regulated militia would be an improvement! Perhaps the country should start adhering to the second amendment, rather than statutorily ignoring the first half?

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#96

Post by mizchief2 »

pjc50 wrote: post #12

Since this is today's gun argument thread, I'll just point out that the UK is currently commemorating the 20th anniversary of its first and last "mass shooting" incident, at a school in Dunblane, Scotland. The ensuing total ban on handguns and further restriction on gun licensing mean that mass shootings are nonexistant, firearm murders are extremely rare (about one per year in a country of 60m), shooting of suspects…

Paris. Virtually the same if not more restrictive gun laws.

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#97

Post by merpnderp »

pjc50 wrote: post #59
jjoonathan wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it worked out quite the way you said: http://crimeresearch.org/2013/12/murder-and-homicide-rates-b... Obligatory un-zeroed-axis warning, but the point stands.

As soon as I saw John Lott, I knew I was going to be dealing with one-sided data. But I'm having trouble replicating that graph from https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachm... It did point out that I was wrong about no mass shootings (p57): "In 2010/11, the police provisionally recorded 642 offences of homicide, which includes the 12 people killed by Derrick Bird in June 2010. Homicide offences i…

But are homicides down overall? What's the purpose of banning firearms if they don't prevent murders? Because if we compared home invasion rates (and perhaps some other categories), I'm guessing they'd look drastically lopsided. In the US state where I live 80% of those convicted of home invasion said they carefully picked a house where they believed the owner was not armed. And the news often carries stories of people stopping assaults, rapes, and home invasions with their personal firearm, nearly always with no one being harmed. These stats are of course not recorded.

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#98

Post by LyndsySimon »

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #38
pjc50 wrote: post #12

Since this is today's gun argument thread, I'll just point out that the UK is currently commemorating the 20th anniversary of its first and last "mass shooting" incident, at a school in Dunblane, Scotland. The ensuing total ban on handguns and further restriction on gun licensing mean that mass shootings are nonexistant, firearm murders are extremely rare (about one per year in a country of 60m), shooting of suspects…

I don't know anyone who is pro-gun that is going to give up his gun as long as there is a terrorism threat to his family and country. Politicians need to squelch the terrorism war chanting if they ever want any form of gun control to pass in the U.S.

I am quite pro-gun, and terrorism doesn't even register on the reasons why. I believe the same could be said of most everyone I know in that community.

It's not about fear; it's primarily about a worldview that centers on individuality and distrust of government.

Re: Toddlers Kill More People in the USA (with guns) Than Terrorists Do

#99

Post by agarden »

smcl wrote: post #89
agarden wrote: post #76

What interests me about the gun debate (if one can call it that), is that there are ways of dying that are considered acceptable risks and ways of dying that are not. If you are driving your kids across town and get t-boned by a drunk driver and everyone dies, that is considered a tragedy. But no one will advocate giving up driving. Something really bad happened, everyone move on with your lives. Or when a relative d…

>> ... t-boned by a drunk driver and everyone dies, that is considered a tragedy. But no one will advocate giving up driving Apples and oranges there. It is a criminal offense to drink drive where I am, and probably where you are too. I find it a bit painful/hilarious that I actually predicted someone would come up with your second example about 25 minutes ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11289280

It is a criminal offense to shoot people.
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