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Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

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Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#91
post #9

He was a pretty argumentative guy, but he was right about so much. He genuinely put his heart into what he believed in. Without him (and Lessig), SOPA easily could have gone the other way. He didn't deserve what the justice system did to him. Let's be honest. Almost no one does. Aaron is definitely missed.

"He was a pretty argumentative guy, but he was right about so much."

Not just in person, Aaron argued by email.

When webpy came out I emailed the webpy mailing list asking Aaron a few questions, made a comment on a trivial bug. I got a response and rebuke. Looking back now I see someone constantly underestimated and who probably had to fight to be heard.

Is he missed, absolutely.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#92
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's beside the point here, really.

It certainly shows the proliferation of ridiculous criminal laws. How many of these "99.9 percent" of "just" cases are simply just persecuting someone for an invented victimless "crime"? If the questionable legality of walking across an empty street doesn't perfectly illustrate how our minds have been warped by a draconian sense of "justice", I don't know what could.

You stepping in front of my car, going through my windshield, and hurting me, is not victimless.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He didn't just do some silly illegal thing; he illegally hacked a network from a closet he should not have been in and hit it with so much traffic that he caused legitimate users of the network to suffer loss of access for multiple days and he did this multiple times after being kicked out. Legitimate users were harmed, regardless of what what anyone feels, Aaron committed a felony and was rightfully arrested. Beyond…

You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. If you're saying that he ought not to been civilly disobedient then that's a different matter but what he did makes him a sort of modern-day hero. That he took his own life makes him a martyr in a weird kind of way. I know that hero and m…

I wonder what effective [as far as achieving an ends] civil disobedience looks like in the era when such is relegated to free speech zones? Will it look like asymmetric, guerrilla like tactics that subvert/coop mechanisms of power that make it hard to leverage garden variety lawyers?

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#94
post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The core principle of the US system of government (and of the British system that precedes it) is that no single person should have absolute power in a criminal trial. Power should be subject to checks and balances, even if those checks and balances are cursory in 95% of cases. Put another way, the US criminal justice system is the equivalent of a software development process where the vast majority of changes go in…

That's wrong. The defendant and their lawyer are doing a code review.

Then like doing a code review in which the reviewer is underpaid and overworked and may not have access to the full code.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#95
post #30
post #9

He was a pretty argumentative guy, but he was right about so much. He genuinely put his heart into what he believed in. Without him (and Lessig), SOPA easily could have gone the other way. He didn't deserve what the justice system did to him. Let's be honest. Almost no one does. Aaron is definitely missed.

>Almost no one does. That's not even remotely true. Our justice system may be severely fucked in many ways, but it's not completely nonfunctional. But we hear about the problems whenever something goes wrong. The other 99.9 percent of the time when things go smoothly we don't even notice...

I don't think 99.9% is accurate at all, unless you're including really routine things like traffic tickets.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It certainly shows the proliferation of ridiculous criminal laws. How many of these "99.9 percent" of "just" cases are simply just persecuting someone for an invented victimless "crime"? If the questionable legality of walking across an empty street doesn't perfectly illustrate how our minds have been warped by a draconian sense of "justice", I don't know what could.

You stepping in front of my car, going through my windshield, and hurting me, is not victimless.

This is exactly the type of knee-jerk reaction that perpetuates the status quo of immoral laws.

In your scenario, there is a civil case for the accident. There can still be a criminal sanction if a pedestrian fails to avoid vehicles (that are obeying traffic laws). This does not change my example, which is an empty street.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. If you're saying that he ought not to been civilly disobedient then that's a different matter but what he did makes him a sort of modern-day hero. That he took his own life makes him a martyr in a weird kind of way. I know that hero and m…

> You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. I didn't mean "morally" wrong, I mean wrong approach. That's not contradictory at all; civil disobedience is not always the correct way to go about change. Sometimes it is, like when its done en-masse; going it alone, wrong approach. >…

You are very seriously misinformed.

For there to be a defensible claim of theft, the property owner must lose their property. Someone experiences something missing.

Infringement exists as a concept and an element of law because it is not theft, specifically.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. If you're saying that he ought not to been civilly disobedient then that's a different matter but what he did makes him a sort of modern-day hero. That he took his own life makes him a martyr in a weird kind of way. I know that hero and m…

> You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. I didn't mean "morally" wrong, I mean wrong approach. That's not contradictory at all; civil disobedience is not always the correct way to go about change. Sometimes it is, like when its done en-masse; going it alone, wrong approach. >…

> Sometimes it is, like when its done en-masse; going it alone, wrong approach.

Perhaps, perhaps not. There's certainly safety in numbers. But this issue is not a huge social issue like, say, nationalist causes or other political issues. This is a kind of geeky issue that only a small fraction of the population gets but that everybody should care about. Also the law-breaking is doing no-one any physical harm. Nobody is going to go hungry because they are deprived of food.

Some argue that mp3 downloads have not affected the music industry's revenues and profits, or at least not by the vast amounts they claim. Similarly I imagine the out of pocket hit to JSTOR to be pretty small, but couple that with the fact that a lot of academic papers were funded by public money then people start seeing things differently. Hence the open-access journal movement and Arxiv and so on. And what about the benefits to society brought about by giving wider access to knowledge? One could start to take a pretty dim view of the ridiculous prices the JSTORs and Elseviers charge.

> it's irrelevant to the conversation.

It's not totally irrelevant. Stealing/theft sounds worse than infringement.

Look, I'm not having a go at you. I just think that Aaron was justified in what he did and I admire him for what he did. There are times for emailing and times for plugging in a network cable, Aaron chose the cable and I don't think that was the wrong approach even though it ended tragically.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. If you're saying that he ought not to been civilly disobedient then that's a different matter but what he did makes him a sort of modern-day hero. That he took his own life makes him a martyr in a weird kind of way. I know that hero and m…

> You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. I didn't mean "morally" wrong, I mean wrong approach. That's not contradictory at all; civil disobedience is not always the correct way to go about change. Sometimes it is, like when its done en-masse; going it alone, wrong approach. >…

Not all crimes are equal.

Re: Aaron Swartz died three years ago today

#100
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can't say that it was wilful civil disobedience and then say that he went about it the wrong way, you contradict yourself as that's kind of the definition of civil disobedience. I didn't mean "morally" wrong, I mean wrong approach. That's not contradictory at all; civil disobedience is not always the correct way to go about change. Sometimes it is, like when its done en-masse; going it alone, wrong approach. >…

Not all crimes are equal.

> Not all crimes are equal.

Never said or implied they were, so what are you responding to?

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