My view of him changed when I saw a recording of him in a documentary saying that murdered Iraqi translators who worked with the US military got what they deserved for working with the enemy.
There is no such recording.
Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
891–900 of 1001 posts
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#892Is anyone else here surprised that the reaction to him being free is so overwhelmingly positive? Assange certainly did great work to reveal government corruption and abuses of power. At the same time, some state secrets are best kept secret for national interests and Assange seemed to show a lack of regard for protecting this type of information. It often seemed that he was working in his own self interest rather tha…
Yeah, sounds like overwhelming positive opinions...
JULIAN!! The guy that embarrassed evil powers all over the world!
What evil powers? Well, the US, the US, and... the US.
I got down-voted by just mentioning he didn't release anything significant on Russia for some reason.
I wouldn't be surprise if some of the massive support we're seeing here in this thread is not completely legit.
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#893Is anyone else here surprised that the reaction to him being free is so overwhelmingly positive? Assange certainly did great work to reveal government corruption and abuses of power. At the same time, some state secrets are best kept secret for national interests and Assange seemed to show a lack of regard for protecting this type of information. It often seemed that he was working in his own self interest rather tha…
I don't think Assange operated in any kind of self-interest per-se, I think he operated based on a principle of maximum transparency. I definitely don't think that is always a positive thing but I struggle to think of anything which Assange leaked which I really disagree with. Probably some parts of cablegate should not have come out as they were very "inside baseball" talk between diplomats and were too easily const…
> he should have had a fair trial with fair charges and faced a fair jury and he never got any of that
Could he have had that if he turned him self when he was originally charged?
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#894I wonder how people would have felt if, instead of releasing stuff about the USA, he had released it about your country's doings instead.
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Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#895Is anyone else here surprised that the reaction to him being free is so overwhelmingly positive? Assange certainly did great work to reveal government corruption and abuses of power. At the same time, some state secrets are best kept secret for national interests and Assange seemed to show a lack of regard for protecting this type of information. It often seemed that he was working in his own self interest rather tha…
I don't think Assange operated in any kind of self-interest per-se, I think he operated based on a principle of maximum transparency. I definitely don't think that is always a positive thing but I struggle to think of anything which Assange leaked which I really disagree with. Probably some parts of cablegate should not have come out as they were very "inside baseball" talk between diplomats and were too easily const…
Well, maximum transparency on why he never published anything significant on Russia would be great.
To me it's a very bad smell when you pretend to fight for press freedom and democratic values, but never say anything bad about regimes where presidents-for-life are extinguishing the free press and poisoning opposition leaders.
It's like these all the crazy conspiracy theories that flourished online during the last decade, that are somehow never hurting Russian interests...
But I must be paranoid, right?
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#896Earlier quoted context omitted.
Clinton is not democracy. Anti-Clinton is not anti democracy. Being anti the US government is not anti democratic. And no, letting USA or any other nation for that matter commit war crimes quietly does not support democracy.
If Assange showed any interest in also undermining Russia or other authoritarian regimes I would feel more compassion. I think criticization of the US foreign policy is fine and the press has a role. To me his case has always been grey. States have secrets its just the nature of the world.
States do have secrets. And when those secrets are grave and destructive, their citizens have a right to know about them.
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#897I'd encourage people to read this excellent piece in the London Review of Books by someone who was contracted to ghostwrite Assange's autobiography, and who initially felt very sympathetic towards the aims of Assange and Wikileaks: https://www.lrb.co.uk/the-paper/v36/n05/andrew-o-hagan/ghost... I found it very insightful and nuanced when it comes to Assange and his motivations, presenting him as neither hero nor vill…
Or like read the Mueller Report which paints him squarely as a villain. He worked with Russia to influence the 2016 election in Trump's favor and then tried to blame Seth Rich. I absolutely cannot fathom how so many people still worship him. He has done some good here and there, but the benefits of things he's leaked are vastly overstated and the harm he has done is very, very real.
> He worked with Russia to influence the 2016 election in Trump's favor
That is not at all a conclusion you can safely take from the Mueller report. Which makes me question whether you actually read it or you consumed it entirely via 2nd hand media reports like Buzzfeed and WaPo.
There is no evidence he was colluding with them, he had encrypted conversations with a GRU agent who had concealed his identity as a hacker, contents of the messages which were never revealed.
Even if he eventually did learn the source why should Wikileaks care where a goldmine of documents comes from? As long as they are authentic.
There’s more than enough motivation for Wikileaks to leak docs by a figurehead of the post 9/11 nation security state, regardless of RU or Trump or petty politics.
I’m sure if the NSA sent him documents about some geopolitical matter they’d leak them too.
> and then tried to blame Seth Rich
He never once directly implicated Seth Rich, the worst thing he did was during a TV interview made a reference to Seths murder and then merely declined to talk about it more:
>> Unbidden, Assange brought up the case of Seth Rich. When asked directly whether Rich was a source, Assange said "we don't comment on who our sources are". Subsequent statements by WikiLeaks emphasized that the organization was not naming Rich as a source.
He also claimed he had physical proof of an inside job, which is entirely possible he was completely taken by the GRU agent who manufactured plausible sounding proof and Assange bought it. These agents are extremely clever and capable, and Assange was in a very poor mental state at the time.
His only true ‘crime’ is not talking about Seth after to appease crazies on the left who see RU conspiracy around every corner nor tamed the right looking to fan the flames on US gov conspiracy theories.
but let’s be honest, that wouldn’t have stopped the hyper partisans on either side. They don’t care either way.
All they want is black/white villains.
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#898Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think Assange operated in any kind of self-interest per-se, I think he operated based on a principle of maximum transparency. I definitely don't think that is always a positive thing but I struggle to think of anything which Assange leaked which I really disagree with. Probably some parts of cablegate should not have come out as they were very "inside baseball" talk between diplomats and were too easily const…
Well, maximum transparency on why he never published anything significant on Russia would be great. To me it's a very bad smell when you pretend to fight for press freedom and democratic values, but never say anything bad about regimes where presidents-for-life are extinguishing the free press and poisoning opposition leaders. It's like these all the crazy conspiracy theories that flourished online during the last de…
Well, would he still be alive if he’d published similar quantities of info on Russia? That’s a pretty simple explanation, he thought his chances of survival were better with Western leaks.
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#899He should not have spent all of this time being persecuted by the US government, but he should have been ostracized by the public long ago. I believe that if not for the prior, the latter would have occurred much more readily. > A reporter worried that Assange would risk killing Afghans who had co-operated with American forces if he put US secrets online without taking the basic precaution of removing their names. "W…
What part of the US government or its decision-makers spent 10 years stewing in prison for bribing Afghans to expose themselves to that same risk of death, or straight up killing many more Afghans for no other reason that they happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time? Does the US government have some special natural right to toy with the lives of Afghans that Assange does not have? Unless you believe it to…
I suspect even the vast majority of decision makers in the US government wouldn't have a conversation like that. And even if they somehow did, how does that change how one should feel about what Assange said? "Well, he was psychopathically toying with people's lives, but so do other people."
Assange seemed virtuous at first but it appears he pivoted into an agenda-driven propagandist after Wikileaks grew more successful and he realized what could be done with it.
Re: Julian Assange has reached a plea deal with the U.S., allowing him to go free
#900Earlier quoted context omitted.
Read some Steven Pinker. Your observations about our present state are not wrong, but seriously consider every other point in human history and realize we are not worse off in any measurable way. In fact, much better.
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In "Better Angels" he chooses "healthy, wealthy and wise" as his three benchmarks. We live longer (and suffer less violence). We have more wealth. We are smarter. That's what "better off" means. You can argue that's not what "better off" means, but you'd be arguing that we should strive for shorter lives, more poverty, and increased stupidity.