Live data from Hacker News

“Great resignation” wave coming for companies

axios.com

891–900 of 1001 posts

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#891
post #685

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, you can employ everyone and they’ll still be useful. Trash on the streets? That’s a job. Pothole in the road, that’s another job. I just commented that the basic necessities of life (food, water, electricity, etc…) can be covered with very few people.

Who supplies the wires? The copper to the wire maker? The plastic for insulation? Transporting it? Building the road/tracks? Etc etc. Of course there are bullshit jobs out there, but I think we are under estimating

I don't think we are underestimating.

When you hit scale like that with specialization, it's conceivable a relatively small amount of jobs can provide a society with the base necessities.

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#892
post #263

> Surveys show anywhere from 25% to upwards of 40% of workers are thinking about quitting their jobs. This number is meaningless without previous year trends. In my circles, everyone from 25-35 is simultaneously preparing to FIRE and no-one that's 35+ has actually changed jobs despite being 'financially independent'. Expressing intent to resign, and actually resigning are completely different things. (edit: to clarif…

>In my circles, everyone from 25-35 is simultaneously preparing to FIRE and no-one that's 35+ has actually changed jobs despite being 'financially independent'. I think less than 1 in 10 people who talk about FIRE have some kind of realistic expectation about FIRE (i.e. you can't stay in the USA and also live like a king)

I always love the phrase "live like a king" like it's some unachievable amount of luxury, when historically it's:

- Mental illness.

- Uncomfortable amounts of stone. Feeling trapped by the system.

- The constant paranoid fear of other people who kind of want you dead.

- Shitting in pots.

It's pretty easy to live like a king in the US, just be homeless.

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#893

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're in for a rudest of all awakenings. You cannot demand salary to be raised without understanding business will be looking elsewhere to fulfill business needs , and will be outsourcing actual labor. Business that can't be outsourced in such conditions (restaurants, hospitality) will be forced to shut down when outsourceable business lays out local workers and replaces them with someone half a world away.

The businesses who won't figure out how to raise wages will go out of business and be replaced by new companies who figured out how to have their employees work more efficiently. It sounds like maybelsyrup has it right, and it's these business owners who are in for the rude awakening. There's a rootbeer stand near me that has a message on their menu saying, "if minimum wage is raised to $15, our prices will go up 10%…

A long time ago I worked for a small family business. They built their business from the ground up, the old man started it in his garage based off of his industry connections from the 70s before being crushed by more effective outfits in the area. When he got too old he retired and handed the new outfit it to his two sons.

I recall being in an all hands bi-weekly meeting on one Saturday, one of the sons stood up and addressed the entire small company:

"I called around and you know what, we pay about average for the industry. Maybe a little bit on the upper side of average. You know, I could raise my prices and maybe pay you all more, but then I would have less customers. and If I have less customers then I can't afford to pay as many of you."

He looked around with an expression that I felt like was almost contempt, but really wasn't The industry is pretty low margin and they got theirs to be very good with volume sales and very good efficiency in processes. He felt the pressure to execute their plans to expand into another, second facility while remaining profitable enough at the original to fund their plans for world domination.

Every day they had customers waiting in line for literally hours for their turn in a crappy, kind of gross facility that had been cobbled together by these DIYers over a number of years. Every day they turned away customers in droves.

I thought to myself: Old man, if you don't raise your prices, you are a priceless fool. If you can't hire enough people to handle your amazing, envy inducing volume, _and_ you have the gall to exclaim proudly that you pay a little bit better than average, then you are surely and rightfully doomed to this mediocrity until you hopefully die.

What he said next only confirmed my young ideations: "We only want the people who _want_ to work here, to work here. If you don't like working here, well you should go somewhere else."

Nowadays they are still in business. They had indeed increased their pay by over 40% in the next couple of years. They opened their second facility years later after more years of project extensions and overruns, just in time for a global pandemic to shutter their entire operation for months. I'm happy they saw the light and realized what you have to do to attract and keep quality skilled employees, but I am for more pleased to be their competitor.

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#894
post #263

> Surveys show anywhere from 25% to upwards of 40% of workers are thinking about quitting their jobs. This number is meaningless without previous year trends. In my circles, everyone from 25-35 is simultaneously preparing to FIRE and no-one that's 35+ has actually changed jobs despite being 'financially independent'. Expressing intent to resign, and actually resigning are completely different things. (edit: to clarif…

Well, this is an ultra-cynical take on the article. It's also a little myopic in the sense that it assumes increased work flexibility must somehow have a high associated cost, such as loss of insurance, or lack of job stability. That just isn't the case. Although I don't believe that we're about to enter some form of work/life balance utopia, just from my own circle of friends, big changes are inbound. Firstly, many…

Actually just requested a 4 day work week for the same amount of money. Wish me luck! Seems reasonable to me tho, I can probably provide the same amount of value as if I worked 5 days a week - but who knows maybe they will just give me more work to do instead!

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#895
post #870

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> for those who no longer wish to work > to those who don't wish to work > those who choose not to work at all > the same for working and for doing nothing, that people choose the latter You're making my point for me with the arbeit macht frei dog-whistles here. So let me be clear: if "work" is defined as "millions of white and blue collar professional lives before Covid, lives replete with Kafka-esque meaninglessnes…

Thank you for articulating what I often have a lot of trouble figuring out how to say. Work, in general, is stupid. The entire concept of it is inane. My fantasy version of utopia is a peaceful, post-scarcity society where no one ever needs to work, and automatically gets a life of luxury simply because it's available and costs nothing. Many people will choose to fill their time with things that look a bit like what…

> My fantasy version of utopia is a peaceful, post-scarcity society where no one ever needs to work, and automatically gets a life of luxury simply because it's available and costs nothing.

Contrast with... "If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face - forever." -- George Orwell.

Sadly, I think we're still closer to Mr Orwell's vision at this point in time, in spite of have more material comforts and resources available than at any point in history.

To get to your utopian vision, we'll need to permanently break free of our primate instincts. That's not going to be easy.

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#896

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Higher education is my main job - we're not seeing an influx like we expected of people returning to college, but we are seeing an increase in non-traditional (24y.o.+) students. They are, to paint with a very broad brush, folks who all worked in food service, retail, or other front-line sales industries. The forced time off last year made them realize they were killing themselves for not very much money, and they're…

There is currently a wild and IMMENSE disconnect from worker attitudes to beliefs about worker attitudes, and I don't know why. Largely because business owners are pushing the "$300/month is making everybody lazy" narrative. There doesn't appear to be much evidence it's true, at least not to the extend business owners would have us believe.

Free money is a disincentive to work. But the effect is strongest on jobs that pay <$15/hr or don't include health insurance.

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#897
post #844
post #263

> Surveys show anywhere from 25% to upwards of 40% of workers are thinking about quitting their jobs. This number is meaningless without previous year trends. In my circles, everyone from 25-35 is simultaneously preparing to FIRE and no-one that's 35+ has actually changed jobs despite being 'financially independent'. Expressing intent to resign, and actually resigning are completely different things. (edit: to clarif…

Everyone from 25-35 is preparing to FIRE?! I wonder, is that economically sustainable?

I think shorter work weeks would be more realistic/desirable than full FIRE. However, I suspect most successful FIRE people must develop a or two hobby that inevitably generates money and keeps them busy. Otherwise most will just get bored out of their mind after 1-2 years.

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#898

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> for those who no longer wish to work > to those who don't wish to work > those who choose not to work at all > the same for working and for doing nothing, that people choose the latter You're making my point for me with the arbeit macht frei dog-whistles here. So let me be clear: if "work" is defined as "millions of white and blue collar professional lives before Covid, lives replete with Kafka-esque meaninglessnes…

I think you're focusing on the wrong things (for instance, no one called anyone a leech). The fact is, we don't live in a post-scarcity society yet. Until we do work can't be about meaning, it has to be about need. Look around your house and life. Count the number of things you own and services you use that are not fun to make or maintain. Until that number hits 0, the majority of society will need to be forced to do…

Meaning, in my view, is not a switch; it's a dial. We can have some more than we have now.

Overall I agree with you: I'm not naive, nor am I a utopianist. I'm fine with more equitable. But we're so entrenched in the status quo that it feels like you have to talk like a revolutionary to get even a shred of "a little more equitable".

Edit: wait though what's a "post-scarcity" economy, anyway, concretely? I've heard since I can remember that we grow enough food as a species to feed everyone (and yet we throw tons of food out) - is that not a decent marker of being post-scarcity? We seem to have enough wealth in the US to be in neverending proxy or non-proxy aggressive wars against various groups of poor and largely non-white people - that wealth, used slightly differently, has got to be some kind of dent in all sorts of scarcity, no? I'm not writing this to attack you whatsoever; I'm genuinely curious. Post-scarcity is a phrase I've heard smarter people than me utter every now and then, and it only just occurred to me that I've never actually figured out what it meant. (I'll Google it now of course but I'd love to hear your perspective all the same. Cheers.)

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#899

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I usually read "People don't want to work!" statements as a sentence fragment. It's the first half of a whole statement. The second half of the statement is a variation on: "for the shitty wages or conditions I'm offering and will rescind at a moment's notice for any made up reason I can imagine". The idea I get from the Cato echoing types is if you have a job you should beg and scrape and genuflect for your betters…

Yes this is exactly right. There's a logical endpoint to their worldview: feudalism. It's got everything they want: the jobs (100% employment!), the genuflecting, the huge profits.

Yes, some are calling it "techno-feudalism".

I think I first heard it from Yanis Varoufakis (https://youtu.be/YpOLHSzZ8jc). Watched as many interviews of him as I could find during those long days at the beginning and middle of the pandemic. He's an exceedingly sane person.

Re: “Great resignation” wave coming for companies

#900
post #632

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a big company and they are an ERP vendor thus rooted in old fashioned manufacturing ideas. They think their size will protect them.

These companies are probably right that their size will protect them. People who are currently employed know better than to take the abuse. That's why these major companies recruit so heavily at colleges and rope in people who have zero perspective on work who don't know any better.

I had a poor college GPA. I missed a lot of good job opportunities because of this. However, it made me un-hireable at a lot of large companies that I might have considered at the time.
Post reply on HN