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Astral to Join OpenAI

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Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#831

Post by jitl »

saalweachter wrote: post #490
alex_suzuki wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here. I’ve adopted uv across all of my Python projects and couldn’t be happier. ty looks very promising as well. Probably inevitable, and I don’t blame the team, I just wish it were someone else.

I kind of feel like the nature of the Python ecosystem is a dozen or so extremely useful frameworks/tools that everyone uses heavily for 3 years and then abandons and never speaks of again. I'm not very deep in Python anymore, but every time I dip my toes back in it's a completely different set of tools, with some noticably rare exceptions (eg, numpy).

i think most of the previous package management tools have been like 70% solutions - for 70% of things, they're much better than previous tools, but then 30% of the problem goes unaddressed. For example, poetry does a good job at managing your package, but decided not to manage python versions. So, I still need some other bootstrap process involving a huge pile of bash.

uv feels like the first 100% coverage solution i've seen in the python space, and it also has great developer experience.

I can't speak to the rest of the ecosystem, when I write python it's extremely boring and I'm still using Flask same as i was in 2016.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#832

Post by jitl »

rgilliotte wrote: post #28
synthc wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

`uv agent` and `bun agent` in 3....2.....1....

Totally agree The value for Anthropic / OAI is that they have a strong interest in becoming the "default" agent. The one that you don't need to install, because it's already provided by your package manager.

idk, i think it's the other way around. I imagine in 5 years my new laptop setup will look like:

    $ curl 'claude.ai/install?key=abcd123' | bash -e
    $ claude 'finish laptop setup from http://github.com/justjake/Dotfiles'
claude will be the one to install / set up the system, not the other way around. claude was certainly the one who installed `uv` on my current machine.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#833

Post by dankwizard »

OpenAI continue to send mixed messaging.

"Our AI can do anything a human can do, better, faster, cheaper" -> Buys a product instead of asking their AI to just make it.

Really doesn't give me confidence in your product!!!!

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#834

Post by moezd »

Noooo, uv, you were the chosen one! (meme)

Jokes aside, these tools are currently absolutely free to use, but imagine a future when your employers demand you use Claude Code because that's the only license agreement they have, and they stop their AI agents from using uv. Sure, we all know how to use uv, but there will also come a time and place when they will ask us to not write a single line of code manually, especially if you have your agents running in "feared the most by clueless middle managers" "production".

Are you ready for factionalism and sandbox wars? Because I'm not. I just want to write my code, push to "production" as I see fit and be happy as pixels start shifting around.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#835

Post by DANmode »

petcat wrote: post #224
volkercraig wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not any different from the launch of the FSF. There's a simple solution. If you don't want your lunch eaten by a private equity firm, make sure whatever tool you use is GPL licensed.

The biggest scam the mega-clouds and the Githubs ever pulled was convincing open source developers that the GPL was somehow out of vogue and BSD/MIT/Apache was better. All so they could just vacuum it all up and resell it with impunity.

They do sort the list of default licenses by alphabetical,

and that seems like a strange choice…

Could you say more?

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#837

Post by DANmode »

roryirvine wrote: post #455
leetrout wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember a somewhat prominent dev in the DC area putting on Twitter around 2012 or so something like "I do plenty of open source coding and I don't put a fucking license on it" and it stuck with me for all these years that it was a weird stance to take.

Dan Bernstein took that attitude back in the 90s - I think his personal theory of copyright went something like "if it doesn't have a license, then it's obviously public domain", which ran counter to the mainstream position of "if it doesn't have a license, then you have to treat it as proprietary". And, sure, djb wasn't actually likely to sue you if you went ahead and distributed modified versions of his software...…

> mainstream position

Not everybody is dictated by corporate attorneys; I don’t think this is an accurate portrayal.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#838

Post by FreakLegion »

blazarquasar wrote: post #786
FreakLegion wrote: post #666

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ruff is performant but finds about half the issues Pylint does (see https://github.com/astral-sh/ruff/issues/970 ). Ty is quantitatively the worst of the well-known type checkers (see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=47398023 ). Uv is Astral's only winner.

You are aware that ty has only recently entered beta status? Ruff isn’t stable yet either and has evolved into the de facto standard for new projects. It has more than double the amount of rules than Pylint does. Also downloaded more than 3 times as often as Pylint in the past month. Pylint has some advantages, sure, but Ruffs adoption speaks for itself. Pylint is 25 years old. You’d hope they do some things better.…

Reread the comment I replied to:

> I would stare longingly into the void, wondering if I can ever work another python project after having experienced uv, ruff, and ty.

You think you're disagreeing with me, but you're agreeing. To wit: The original post is silly, because ty is beta quality and Ruff isn't stable yet either. Your words.

These are just tools, Pylint included. Use them, don't use then, make them your whole personality to the point that you feel compelled to defend them when someone on the Internet points out their flaws. Whatever churns your butter.

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#839

Post by fnordpiglet »

lukeschlather wrote: post #394
fnordpiglet wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is even if an OSS had the resources (massive data centers the size of NYC packed with top end custom GPU kits) to produce the weights, you need enormous VRAM laden farms of GPUs to do inference on a model like Opus 4.6. Unless the very math of frontier LLMs changes, don’t expect frontier OSS on par to be practical.

I feel like you're overstating the resources required by a couple orders of magnitude. You do need a GPU farm to do training, but probably only $100M, maybe $1B of GPUs. And yes, that's a lot of GPUs, but they will fit in a single datacenter, and even in dollar terms, there are many individual buildings in NYC that are cheaper.

I refer you to the data centers under construction roughly the size of Manhattan to do next generation model training. Granted they’re also to house inference, but my statement wasn’t hyperbole, it’s based on actual reality. To accommodate the next generation of frontier training it’s infeasible for any but the most wealthy organizations on earth to participate. OSS weights are toys. (Mind you i like toys)

Re: Astral to Join OpenAI

#840

Post by DeathArrow »

NiloCK wrote: post #67

A concern: More and more plainly, OpenAI and Anthropic are making plays to own (and lease) the "means of production" in software. OK - I'm a pretty happy renter right now. As they gobble up previously open software stacks, how viable is it that these stacks remain open? It seems perfectly sensible to me that these providers and their users alike have an interest in further centralizing the dev lifecycle - eg, if Clau…

>As they gobble up previously open software stacks, how viable is it that these stacks remain open?

My question is if them gobbling up the alternatives will make room for other alternatives to grow.

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