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Time to Take a Stand

blog.samaltman.com

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Re: Time to Take a Stand

#831

Post by tomjen3 »

MisterBastahrd wrote: post #105
djrogers wrote: post #8

> In doing so, we should not demonize Trump voters—most of them voted for him for reasons other than the promise of a Muslim ban. We need their eventual support in resisting actions like these, and we will not get it if we further isolate them. This is very important people - calling everyone who voted for Trump a racist homophobe, a moron, and not deserving of the franchise is not going to help anything. I didn't vo…

The hell I won't. Southerners didn't acknowledge that racism was wrong and slavery was evil until it was beaten into their hard skulls to the point where it was completely socially unacceptable to state a preference for either. I know this because I'm FROM there.

At the cost of a war that killed the most Americans in history.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#832

Post by Mendenhall »

I stopped reading as soon as I got to "Muslim ban". Muslims did not get banned.

A Muslim ban would mean any Muslim coming from any country is banned. Sad that this is the level of discourse and understanding these days.

I care more about correct terms than if you are for or against it. Stoking fears over something that does not exist is childish at best.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#834

Post by facetube »

maxnevermind wrote: post #693
m_fayer wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm already seeing this in Berlin. I know multiple engineers and academics who have abandoned career moves to the US because they "don't want to live in such a toxic environment."

I'm thinking about moving to Berlin, but a million of illegal economic migrants from middle east in Germany and Trump policy in the US regarding them make US much more attractive option

Are you referring to the families of refugees fleeing indiscriminate bombing and war?

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#835

Post by czep »

ebfd wrote: post #771
nerfhammer wrote: post #713

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a couple coworkers from Iran. Would you be willing to look them in the face and explain to them how they're banned re-entry into the country?

Sure. "Muslim immigrants as a group consume more in societal resources than they contribute in taxes or skilled labor."

> "Muslim immigrants as a group consume more in societal resources than they contribute in taxes or skilled labor."

There are several issues with this type of justification.

1) We do not value human beings based on whether they are net positive or negative contributors to societal resources.

2) We do not value human beings based on whether they are net positive or negative contributors to societal resources. (This point is rather important, I wanted you to read it so I included it twice).

3) Babies and elderly are a drain so why not give them the same treatment? If your answer is "because babies will eventually become contributors and elderly once were" then consider the following:

4) Many of these refugees are from war-torn countries, they have few resources of their own and perhaps little education. It might take a generation or two before they fully come into their own and contribute to society in the same way that many other immigrant groups have in the past. Give it time, and they too will contribute.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#836

Post by innocentoldguy »

wolf550e wrote: post #536
innocentoldguy wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't vote for Donald, because I think he sucks, but what other non-racist option was there? Hillary? Hillary exhibits just as much racism as Donald does; just in a different way. Hillary, along with many members of her party, are paternalistic racists. In other words, they hide their racism behind agendas that treat minorities and other groups like children. They feel that they are superior and better than other…

r: term limits for legislators. California tried that. Turns out representatives without experience at drafting and passing legislation rely on lobbyists with the requisite experience, and the power shifts from nominally accountable representatives to unaccountable lobbyists.

How is that any different than now? At least the public-facing oligarchy would change every few years.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#837

Post by stephancoral »

zeteo wrote: post #169

>1. Call 2. Participate 3. Share 4. Vote This is the same kind of bullshit that's lost Hillary the election and got us here in the first place. It might have worked in the '90s to get a gold medal for Rosa Parks. It will not work in 2017 to make Trump back off his core message. The problem here is not that your side isn't loud enough and can't get political attention for an issue. The problem is that the opposing sid…

Voting and participating lost Hillary the election?

The fuck are you even talking about? That makes no sense.

Furthermore, millions of people voted for Clinton over Trump. Trump has the lowest approval ratings of a new president ever. It's very clear that the majority of the country is against him and his policies.

>Instead of doing all this "yell out louder" crap, any serious opposition should rather do some serious soul searching to figure out how to win back key constituencies

How do you do that without calling, participating, and sharing? These are all key on-the-ground actions for building a political base.

I've worked in politics and organizing for 20 years. You don't know what you're talking about in the slightest. Please stop spreading bullshit.

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#838

Post by thetruthseeker1 »

I hope I am not downvoted because I have a different view.

I think Trump is a show man to some degree. He has said in the past he wanted to be in Hollywood. This is important to understand what drives him.

I think what Trump is doing is a part of a show, to tell his voters he is credible. But I think his long term policies will not be this drastic even if they are. I think the tech community should work with him to do the right thing, dissenting with him is not the right way at this point in time. It is too early to decide that you are against Trump ( as a Tech community).

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#839

Post by stephancoral »

naaaaak wrote: post #253
the8472 wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is the same kind of bullshit that's lost Hillary the election and got us here in the first place. Wasn't low democrat turnout part of the problem?

Wasn't running the most corrupt, least trustworthy candidate who couldn't cite a single accomplishment in 30 years of public "self service" THE problem?

Lol you mean the candidate that got more votes than Trump?

Re: Time to Take a Stand

#840

Post by mcguire »

TuringNYC wrote: post #454
finid wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Muslims, then GC holders. Very soon, certain group of citizens will suffer the same fate. The prison walls are getting closer... By the time you're able to reach out and touch them, it'd be too late.

Well, that didnt take long. The definition is about to get broader, per WSJ: In a statement that the State Department is due to release, which was reviewed by The Wall Street Journal, the 90-day visa moratorium extends beyond just citizens of Iraq, Iran, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, Libya, and Yemen. It also applies to people who originally hail from those countries but are traveling on a passport issued by any other natio…

Huh. My next door neighbor is an American citizen, born in Iran. He left before the Shah was deposed. He owns a successful local company. Sounds like this would apply to him.

No wonder I haven't heard from them in a few months.

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