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Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

cnn.com

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Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#821

Post by [deleted] »

tasogare wrote: post #784
passing_by_and wrote: post #767

What I really like about all these different threads and topics on COVID is the mastery of control that is shown. We have viable treatments that work and could be prescribed en masse. Not discussed, not mentioned. The sole discussion topic is "vaccines" and mask theatre. Totally ignoring any inconvenient data about either. Everyone's focus is to tear each other apart about which level of destruction is best for the n…

We are in the worst timeline. At first I didn't had too much anger again the people willing to take part in the phase III trial, they were mostly just a SNS annoyance with their virtue signaling. Their choice, my choice. Now they're writing literal hateful messages all over the internet about people like me who made an informed choice but moreover fully supports authoritarian measures that are taken just to fuck with…

[deleted]

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#822

Post by manwe150 »

tasogare wrote: post #784
passing_by_and wrote: post #767

What I really like about all these different threads and topics on COVID is the mastery of control that is shown. We have viable treatments that work and could be prescribed en masse. Not discussed, not mentioned. The sole discussion topic is "vaccines" and mask theatre. Totally ignoring any inconvenient data about either. Everyone's focus is to tear each other apart about which level of destruction is best for the n…

We are in the worst timeline. At first I didn't had too much anger again the people willing to take part in the phase III trial, they were mostly just a SNS annoyance with their virtue signaling. Their choice, my choice. Now they're writing literal hateful messages all over the internet about people like me who made an informed choice but moreover fully supports authoritarian measures that are taken just to fuck with…

You mention ‘informed’, but are you aware of the delta variant and that scientists sometimes learn new things?

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#823

Post by Volundr »

snidane wrote: post #816
landemva wrote: post #796

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'... that can only be achieved by having a large percentage of population vaccinated.' Only?? The mortality profile is grossly _weighted_ by lifestyle choices such as low cardiovascular health, type 2 diabetes, and obesity. I am in decent health, got quite sick with the 'rona this year, and toughed it out at home. I later got blood test to confirm anti-bodies and a recovered letter from Dr.

These cohorts are the cash cows for pharma industry. Surprise surprise they'd rather sacrifice 99.9% of healthy population to save their major source of perpetual income. No hate against chronically ill, obese and diabetic, just pointing out the incentives here.

40% of Americans are obese, and 75% are overweight. Pretty far from "99.9% healthy population".

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#824

Post by mattrighetti »

wolverine876 wrote: post #804
mattrighetti wrote: post #501

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Your freedom ends where your fist ends and my nose begins. I see this used every time, if you pay close attention to the phrase you will notice that it can literally be used every time by every party. There will be people thinking that you can't limit their "freedom" because a vaccine is out there at this point and those who fears for their lives can take it and forget about the virus (in most cases). There will be…

> There will be people thinking that you can't limit their "freedom" because a vaccine is out there at this point and those who fears for their lives can take it and forget about the virus (in most cases). I don't understand this statement: Who is talking about limiting the freedom of vaccinated people and in what way? > if you pay close attention to the phrase you will notice that it can literally be used every time…

> Who is talking about limiting the freedom of vaccinated people and in what way?

Vaxxed would like to limit unvaxxed "freedom" even though they are not threatened at all by them, this is what science has been telling us for at least 5 months: vaccines work, they drastically reduce breakthrough infection and death, I don't think I need to show you the data on that.

> If I'm standing still and you punch me in the nose, how could both parties use that argument?

The fact is that they are not punching your nose at all. If you don't want to get punched you have a free effective vaccine that will put a giant steel wall in front of you and protect your nose from punches. If you don't want to get vaxxed it's your responsibility to consider that you will get a punch in your nose sooner or later.

> Your personal choice is irrelevant.

I strongly agree with this, that's why I will never limit others based on something I want or think, ever.

> You can not care about and 'respect' them choosing to drive the wrong way on the freeway with you in the car, but so what?

Nobody is driving the wrong way, getting vaxxed is not mandatory at the moment so they are doing so legally.

> They are still risking other people's lives.

Let's pretend this is true (in my useless opinion it is not since everybody can take the vaccine and be safe), as far as I know vaxxed can still spread the virus. What we also know is that vaxxed people seems to get _less_ infected, but they could very well be infected too (recent UKHA data shows that on average vaxxed people will get infected with 60% less probability than unvaxxed). Since this is a matter of getting infected or not, I don't see why vaxxed (according to your phrase) are exempt from risking other people's live just because they have a 60% less probability of getting infected and spread the virus. Me and you could very easily spread the virus and risk other people's lives as an unvaxxed.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#825

Post by jyscao »

comex wrote: post #723
hncurious wrote: post #709

If we were a serious society, then the conversation would be about: immune vs non-immune high risk vs low risk infectious vs non-infectious But no, it's jabbed vs unjabbed. It doesn't make sense. Everyone in Germany who wants the vaccine has had it, and if you've had Covid, you're about as protected as the vaccinated. Furthermore, leaky vaccines don't prevent transmission, can't eliminate the virus (animal reservoirs…

> Furthermore, the vaccines don't prevent transmission, They do prevent transmission, since they make people less likely to be infected, and if you're not infected with the virus you won't transmit it. The vaccines are somewhat less effective at preventing people from being infected at all than they are at preventing hospitalization and death, but still significantly effective. [1] [1] https://www.nytimes.com/interac…

> They do prevent transmission, since they make people less likely to be infected, and if you're not infected with the virus you won't transmit it.

Incorrect. Intramuscular vaccines induce antibody production at nearby lymph nodes inside of the body; and these mRNA vaccines in particular also cause S-antibodies to circulate in one's blood (even though that's unintended and the long term effects are still unknown).

Because the intramuscular route of administration, S-antibodies are not present in significant quantities inside the lungs of vaccinated individuals. Thus with covid-19 being an airborne disease, vaccinated people can still exhale virus-containing breaths and transmit the disease to others, who can then go on to contract the illness, whether they're vaccinated or not. So while the vaccines offer protection against serious illness to those who receive it, it certainly does not prevent transmission.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#826

Post by mattrighetti »

comex wrote: post #723
hncurious wrote: post #709

If we were a serious society, then the conversation would be about: immune vs non-immune high risk vs low risk infectious vs non-infectious But no, it's jabbed vs unjabbed. It doesn't make sense. Everyone in Germany who wants the vaccine has had it, and if you've had Covid, you're about as protected as the vaccinated. Furthermore, leaky vaccines don't prevent transmission, can't eliminate the virus (animal reservoirs…

> Furthermore, the vaccines don't prevent transmission, They do prevent transmission, since they make people less likely to be infected, and if you're not infected with the virus you won't transmit it. The vaccines are somewhat less effective at preventing people from being infected at all than they are at preventing hospitalization and death, but still significantly effective. [1] [1] https://www.nytimes.com/interac…

Lower probability of getting infected != prevent infection.

Lower probability of getting infected == lower probability of spreading the virus != vaccines prevent transmission.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#827

Post by esyir »

bllguo wrote: post #503
serial_dev wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure what to say without being labeled an anti vaxxer... I was very sick for a week after each shot. I'm 30, I work from home, I work out, I'm lean and only go out when running in the forest and buy food. I can't possibly know what would happen if I caught covid, but I wish the vaccination (I'm already vaxxed, but I mean the boosters) was my choice. With my reaction to the vaccines, it's two weeks a year guarante…

if this is your body's reaction to the vaccine, what makes you think your chance of getting very sick from actual covid is very low?

One of the more common causes of vaccine related injury is allergic reaction to one or more of the adjuvant or carriers, rather than to the antigenic load.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#828

Post by guscost »

“ And how we burned in the camps later, thinking: What would things have been like if every Security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family? Or if, during periods of mass arrests, as for example in Leningrad, when they arrested a quarter of the entire city, people had not simply sat there in their lairs, paling with terror at every bang of the downstairs door and at every step on the staircase, but had understood they had nothing left to lose and had boldly set up in the downstairs hall an ambush of half a dozen people with axes, hammers, pokers, or whatever else was at hand?... The Organs would very quickly have suffered a shortage of officers and transport and, notwithstanding all of Stalin's thirst, the cursed machine would have ground to a halt! If...if...We didn't love freedom enough. And even more – we had no awareness of the real situation.... We purely and simply deserved everything that happened afterward.”

- Solzhenitsyn

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#829

Post by manwe150 »

disambiguation wrote: post #762
crooked-v wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With exponential spread, the actual number of ICU beds really doesn't matter, because whatever you've got will be overwhelmed across a similar timeframe anyway. The only way to actually fix the problem is to get the R-value below 1, which requires mass vaccinations.

I can't believe people still think herd immunity is possible. Delta. Omicron. Our technology sucks and is slow, we can't achieve R < 1 this way.

It can’t be all that bleak.

The mRNA technology would let us inject omicron-specific boosters tomorrow, but then there is a lot of other safety hurdles that have to be met before it gets authorized and then distribution hurdles to convince people to take it…

Mathematically, we will get to R=1 this way, some day or another, with some percentage of people getting it via illness and some via vaccination. The choice is still ours on how and when.

Re: Germany locks down unvaccinated people, as leaders plan to make shots compulsory

#830

Post by daddylongstroke »

Krasnol wrote: post #720
fileeditview wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So true and not mentioned enough by the media. The fact that we lost more than 4000 ICU beds over last year (during the Corona pandemic!!) because of personnel shortage is mind-boggling. Instead of rewarding those who worked these horrible jobs and maybe attract new workers with better conditions (e.g. more holidays), better pay or tax reduction, our politicians did campaigning and ignored the upcoming winter. Now th…

> So true and not mentioned enough by the media. This is nonsense. The topic has been in the news almost from the beginning of the crisis. The government is being constantly criticised for that. Why do you people repeat this? It's a lie. The fact that this topic is now being used by anti-vaxxers to cloud their anti-social behaviour and shift the growing anger of the vaccinated population away from them is ridiculous.…

Why are the vaccinated so threatened by the non-vaccinated in Germany? Why the anger? Why the fear?
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