New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike • Hacker News Board

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#801

Post by dakiol » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 9:54 PM UTC

jajko wrote: post #493

kortilla wrote: post #356

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They don’t think RTO is reasonable, which is a completely logical stance to take if you’ve setup your life working from home (esp if it’s hours from the office).

... which is something people did on their own, without agreeing with their employers on duration etc. I love working from home, but its just a non-guaranteed perk that can go away anytime and eventually it will, and companies shouldn't break their backs to accommodate people. There is free job market to match one's expectations, triple especially in places like New York. I really, really don't get folks who setup th…

> but its just a non-guaranteed perk that can go away anytime and eventually it will, and companies shouldn't break their backs to accommodate people

I think this is the key to the question. We should start seeing WFH as a right rather than as a perk. Just like the dozens of other rights we have gained over the years. If it were for the companies, we would still be working 6 days/week, 80h/day with little or no vacation/sick/parental days. I'm sure those rights were considered normal in the past but not anymore.

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#802

Post by insane_dreamer » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 9:55 PM UTC

heraldgeezer wrote: post #363

insane_dreamer wrote: post #161

Have devs at any of the large tech companies ever tried to unionize? If not, why not?

I get that this is an american comment. But usually you are focused on each trades. In Sweden we have an "office worker" union. - https://www.unionen.se/in-english/this-is-unionen You can be in finance, hr, it, dev, engineering etc. Because we all want transparency, good salary, protection, 40h work weeks, overtime etc. A union is not going to be involved in specifics like if we use Linux or Microsoft, so why does it…

Because software development is a “trade” and like you said most unions are build around trades. “Office worker” is not a trade/profession.

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#803

Post by derektank » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 9:55 PM UTC

__loam wrote: post #797

lxgr wrote: post #719

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did he actually say that? Because in the article, there's only a tweet of him saying that Perplexity is "on standby to help", of which "offering to replace striking staff with AI" seems a pretty strong mischaracterization. Update: The headline (but not the URL) was just changed to "Perplexity CEO offers AI company’s services to replace striking NYT staff" (emphasis mine).

Crossing the picket line like this is craven and opportunistic.

Pretty opportunistic to strike right before what is likely one of the highest traffic days for the NYT all year too

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#804

Post by wiseowise » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 9:58 PM UTC

ramesh31 wrote: post #254

mym1990 wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

10 years ago was a very different time...

>10 years ago was a very different time... Indeed. When tech workers actually had some bargaining power. The rise of remote work, AI, and the flooding of the industry with bootcamp and CS grads has changed everything. We'll probably look back at the last 20 years as a golden age akin to the postwar manufacturing boom in the US, where a single person could reasonably provide for a family.

10 years ago it was “y’all will be replaced with cheap South Asian developers”, time is a flat circle.

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#805

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 10:02 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #597

legitster wrote: post #323

> The two sides negotiated until late Sunday. The sticking points in recent days were over whether they could get a “just cause” provision in their contract, which means workers can be terminated only for misconduct or another such reason; pay increases and pay equity; and return-to-office policies. This seems like a LOT of issues that still need to be hammered out. It would be one thing if they were disagreeing abou…

> Striking during election week is kind of a crappy move to pull NYTimes has dragged out the negotiations for months, refusing to have a contract. It's kinda a make or break time for the union. When would be better to strike, what time would NYTimes and the audience prefer? It should be during a choke point otherwise management wouldn't listen. Additionally, this is a high traffic time, but not really a high stakes t…

[deleted]

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#806

Post by sp527 » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 10:05 PM UTC

wormlord wrote: post #738

jjcm wrote: post #609

For reference, here's a current job opening for NYT's tech org for a senior software developer: https://boards.greenhouse.io/thenewyorktimes/jobs/4472655005 Salary is 140-155k USD. For reference, here's levels.fyi's breakdown of the New York city area: https://www.levels.fyi/t/software-engineer/locations/new-yor... Median total comp is 185k. It seems like their total comp for NYT is slightly above the mark based on r…

In NYC?? Amazon entry level devs in LCOL areas were making that much in base alone in 2021.

Try redoing your comparison in units of stress per dollar

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#807

Post by zmgsabst » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 10:06 PM UTC

SiempreViernes wrote: post #791

slt2021 wrote: post #735

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>According to the study, Black tech workers at the newspaper make 26 percent less than white workers >>women, who make up over 40 percent of the Tech Guild, earn 12 percent less on average than men claims like these always irk me, like did you just compare averages by race/gender? Whoever made this claim, did they control for other factors, like job title/level or productivity? its like the famous "gender pay gap" c…

> claims like these always irk me, like did you just compare averages by race/gender? Probably not, the striking union is the one that contains all the data analysts at the NYTimes, so they have some experience with sociology data. > Whoever made this claim, did they control for other factors, like job title/level or productivity? As explained in the article, the data analysts union mad this claim, it's even explicit…

> finance and sales

Weird that jobs with performance bonuses are the largest gap — but that perhaps suggests that the cause isnt sexism in the workplace, but yet more confounders they didn’t account for.

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#808

Post by wiseowise » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 10:07 PM UTC

alistairSH wrote: post #307

thinkingtoilet wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People will laugh at it, but pet bereavement should absolutely be a thing. The saddest I've ever been in my life was when my dog died. Perhaps seven days is a bit much, but when you go to the bargaining table you don't start with what you want, you start past that point then negotiate down.

The saddest I've ever been in my life was when my dog died. I take it you've never lost a child? Because I've lost both and sad as it was, losing a dog doesn't even come close. Losing the dog was sad, but I got over it and eventually adopted another pup. Losing the child was so unimaginably awful that I struggle to find the words... Police knocking on my door at 2am to tell me. Calling my wife at 2:30am to tell her (…

I’m sorry about you child, but it doesn’t mean that we have to belittle someone’s grief because you’ve had it worse.

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#809

Post by pyuser583 » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 10:07 PM UTC

marricks wrote: post #733

notatoad wrote: post #698

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>When would be better to strike i think the point the parent is making is that a better time to strike would be when they have specific demands that management is able to meet - to get them to the negotiating table, or to get them to sign a contract. but in the case where management is already at the negotiating table, and there's no contract to be signed, it's not clear what short-term goal a strike is meant to achi…

> when they have specific demands that management is able to meet It's just wild how management is able to unilaterally decide what is and isn't reasonable, and just label unions as childish. "We want to help you, but you're hurting us!" is one small step away from "gosh we love the idea of unions but it causes too much friction between workers and management, and trust me, management knows best."

NY Times management has been accused of some extremely shady stuff. For example, their chief union negotiator is also responsible for disciplining wayward staff members. Union members who strongly advocate get more infractions and punishments than those who are passive.

Re: New York Times Tech Guild goes on strike

#810

Post by wiseowise » Mon, Nov 04, 2024, 10:10 PM UTC

snozolli wrote: post #295

thefourthchime wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is that it comes off as egregiously woke.

"Woke" makes absolutely zero sense here. I think the word you're looking for is "sensitive".

Anything you don’t like is woke. No sexist jokes in office? Woke. Bro culture is frowned upon? Woke. Can’t make jokes about gay and black people? Woke, woke, woke.