Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces • Hacker News Board

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#801

Post by shagmin » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:47 PM UTC

throwawaycuriou wrote: post #123

andrewla wrote: post #63

The post is now deleted, but is available at https://web.archive.org/web/20210601160519/https://www.kamau... Repeated here for clarity: > If I were a Jew today, my sensibilities would be tormented. I would find it increasingly difficult to reconcile the long cycles of oppression that Jewish people have endured and the insatiable appetite for vengeful violence that Israel, my homeland, has now acquired. This reconcili…

Thanks for the full context. Much of the reaction here is due to his mistake of placing 'If I were a Jew' when based on the rest of the essay I'd estimate he meant to say 'If I were Israeli'. Had he done so the tea shop would still have all its crockery intact.

After reading the post this is the same impression I get. His views don't seem that different from someone like Noam Chomsky, just not articulated as well.

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#802

Post by fwip » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:47 PM UTC

fighterpilot wrote: post #747

munificent wrote: post #666

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get where you're coming from and it took me (a white person from the US) a long time to wrap my head around what most progressives talking about responsibility and the US's history of slavery were really trying to say. Let me try to explain with an analogy. Your grandfather dies. In his will, he leaves you his house, which has been in your family several generation. It's a nice place, better than the crappy apartme…

I reject this way of thinking because it groups second generation Irish immigrants with those who inherited wealth from the days of slavery. I get that you're trying to be charitable but there really isn't a valid defence for an ideology that tries to slap a label onto heterogeneous groups of people with nothing in common beyond their skin tone. It is a racist way of thinking and should be called out as such.

Whiteness is a social construct, you're absolutely right. It's one that our society and institutions consistently reward, though.

Maybe the Irish person is the first guy's roommate or spouse - they didn't directly inherit the free water from their direct ancestors, but they're still getting free water from next door.

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#803

Post by czzr » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:48 PM UTC

sterlind wrote: post #184

He also wrote a blog post in which he confesses being homophobic: https://web.archive.org/web/20210603012214/https://www.kamau... I was confused about why Google said "LGBTQ+ community" in addition to Jewish community, and I think that's it.

How sad that a well written post that openly and rationally speaks of his internal struggles, and ends in a positive place, gets dismissed as “homophobic”.

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#804

Post by frockington1 » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:48 PM UTC

vernie wrote: post #309

frockington1 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And that is why I stopped calling myself a progressive years ago. In my youth I thought progressive meant trying to continually better yourself and your community. Now the focus seems to be on cancelling any viewpoint that conflicts with yours. The new trend of digging further and further back in the past makes it even more counter to my previous beliefs of the word

So what do you call yourself now?

Nothing, politically speaking Shrek is my role model. Get off my swamp, I don't care at all as long as people leave me alone

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#805

Post by at_a_remove » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:51 PM UTC

chewmieser wrote: post #315

frockington1 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And that is why I stopped calling myself a progressive years ago. In my youth I thought progressive meant trying to continually better yourself and your community. Now the focus seems to be on cancelling any viewpoint that conflicts with yours. The new trend of digging further and further back in the past makes it even more counter to my previous beliefs of the word

I just don't understand this viewpoint as it completely ignores the history of humanity. "Cancel culture" has been used for many centuries to silence dissenters. Take a look at Galieleo as an example. He was excommunicated or "canceled" by religious organizations that held the primary means of power. He was even forced to recant his positions by these groups. How is this any different than today?

I will address this in the spirit with which it was intended.

Cancellation, back then, was largely top-down, driven by kings and popes. The current form of cancellation emerges from below, pressuring larger organizations to fire people and denounce them. And as I have mentioned elsewhere in this, those calling for cancellation derive increased status when their attempts succeed.

It's a bit more equivalent to witch hunt mania than papal disapproval.

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#806

Post by mcguire » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:51 PM UTC

woodruffw wrote: post #772

I think there are a few noteworthy components to this: * Kamau's post conflates Jews with Israel, which is simultaneously a common, innocent mistake and a rhetorical strategy used by Zionists and the far right. Having read the actual post[1], I'm inclined to believe that Kamau falls for the aforementioned strategy. * One of the Twitter accounts linked in the article, "StopAntisemitism," is a Zionist organization. The…

Excellent point!

But it's not a rhetorical strategy just used by Zionists and the far right. Zionists, as you say, wish to conflate Jews with Israel, so that any criticism of the latter will appear to be an attack on the former. Anti-Semites wish to conflate Israel with all Jews so that criticism of the former can be made to be an attack on the latter.

It's a mess.

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#807

Post by throwaway894345 » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:51 PM UTC

ABCLAW wrote: post #692

ant6n wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it was also quoted worse in the tweets. "If I were a Jew I would be concerned about my insatiable appetite for war and killing in defense of myself," (…) "If I were a Jew today, my sensibilities would be tormented. I would find it increasingly difficult to reconcile the long cycles of oppression that Jewish people have endured and the insatiable appetite for vengeful violence that Israel, my homeland, has now acq…

I think with the more fulsome context you've provided that the prior post's attempt to reduce his statement as critical of Israelis alone is a bit reductionist; his argument here extends to the diaspora that also unwaveringly support Israel in their expansionary policy. I don't feel that position is anti-Semitic either, but I think it needs to be noted for the sake of intellectual honesty. He is critiquing a LOT of J…

Even if he isn't saying all Jews are bad, it still reads something like "I'm just saying Israel is insatiably, vengefully violent and [an awful lot of] Jews support Israel...".

I'm all for charitability, but it feels like we're contorting ourselves--why would any tolerant person with a decent penchant for writing not keep a wider berth between their criticism of Israel and antisemitism? I understand that there are always going to be bad faith people who willfully misinterpret all criticism of Israel with antisemitism, but those people aside I've never found it particularly difficult to criticize Israel in a way which is unambiguously tolerant of and respectful toward Jews (and he seems like a better writer than I am).

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#808

Post by GoodJokes » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:58 PM UTC

Posting is a sickness.

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#809

Post by yakshaving_jgt » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 6:58 PM UTC

fwip wrote: post #775

loveistheanswer wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Growing to overcome past problems is not sufficient. Their assumption is moreso that we cant grow to overcome past problems. So the only way to build themselves up is to tear others down. Thats why the popular "anti-racism" philosophy is so antithetical to and ignorant of the lives and philosophies of many of the greatest civil rights leaders such as Frederick Douglass, Booker T Washington, and MLK.

Anti-racism doesn't say that people cannot grow.

Some self-described anti-racists do indeed hold that idea[0].

[0]: https://www.ocpathink.org/post/does-race-massacre-silence-sh...

Re: Google removes its head of diversity after 2007 blog post surfaces

#810

Post by thu2111 » Thu, Jun 03, 2021, 7:00 PM UTC

yownie wrote: post #790

sirjee wrote: post #660

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty sure he was not chief diversity officer 14 years ago but I agree it should have been "If I were an israeli...".

Which begs the question, how does one go from that blog post to a diversity officer at one of the most famous Corporations in the world?

But this is all very consistent. Most people noticed many years ago that the people who most loudly claim to be fighting racism are always huge racists themselves. This is so common, and so obvious, the only reason it's attracting attention at all is because somewhat unusually it's Jews who are the target today, instead of white men. If the same quote about war had been made with white men instead of Jews nobody at Google would have cared. And arguably they don't care at all because the guy is not fired, just re-assigned, which tells you everything you need to know about what that company has become.

And it's not really surprising that the target are Jews. In America this doesn't seem to be the case so much, but in Europe when the left engage in racism, it's always against their own countryfolk or Jews. Diversity programs, however they started, long ago became a left wing movement.

Frankly it's a lot more shocking when someone working in diversity does not turn out to be racist or sexist. Those are very rare people indeed. Oddly, I vaguely recalled the Google head of diversity making some sensible comments some years ago, but I don't recognize this name. It seems he's actually just "a" head of diversity, not "the" head.