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Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

blog.desk.pm

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Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno dude, I bought it, tried to use it, and quickly discovered that it's a pretty poor product. I won't go into it here, because it's off-topic and I left a two-star review in the App Store anyway. But my impression of the app is that its success is mainly due to marketing savvy and the current infatuation with "minimalist" writing apps that use Markdown. So I would say yes, DF advertising clearly worked here, an…

As a writer, I like the idea of a minimalist writing app. I really do. It feels natural. Just you and a blank screen so you can tap away and kill whatever demons are haunting you. Except there is a problem: serious writers need more than 'minimalism'. All the authors and novelists and long-form fiction writers I know have reams upon reams of notes, plot information, and character data cluttering up their MS Word (arg…

You do understand that Desk and Scrivener are not really in competition, right? Or do you also lecture Miata owners about how they're cute vehicles and all, but they should really know that Miatas are terrible for long-distance cargo hauling?

(Edited...) I'm not particularly enamored of "minimalist" writing apps, either -- I'd really like to see a prose-focused editor with modern design sensibility with the editing capability of Nota Bene for DOS two decades ago (which, it's worth noting, Scrivener lacks as well) -- but you're being unduly snippy about it, I think. I write and even occasionally sell stories that are, in fact, written in Markdown in relatively minimal editing environments. Not every story needs research folders, timelines and an index card view.

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can always get a refund for the app... and I'm really sorry it didn't work for you. It's honestly really tough being an indie developer... I have to do EVERYTHING related to not just building the DAMN THING but all of the business, marketing, Q/A, financials/accounting, blogging... the list is eternally-long. v1.0 was lucky... in a lot of ways. v1.1 addressed a shit-ton of issues... v1.2, out in a week (hopefully…

Believe me, I understand how hard it is. I've been working alone on a project for the past 2.5 years now (not quite ready for prime-time, but soon), so I know exactly what you mean. However, two things are just inexcusable to me: 1) this is a writing app /with no support for paragraph breaks/. That is unbelievable to me. Nobody who writes for a living can use an app that shows all of your text to you as a really larg…

If a programmer builds an amazingly perfect app, but has no users to see it, did she really build it? -Confucius

In less snarky terms, I think focusing on marketing is super important. The faults and missing features can be fixed when you have users and money to pay for the work to do so. I'm sick of using a nice obscure app that is abandoned because I'm one of the few people who use it, so I'm less harsh on marketing as opposed to "more coding" than you.

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#83
post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$30 is most certainly not "a lot of money", and it is this attitude that makes indie development so hard these days. This app is meant for serious bloggers (i.e. those that spend many hours writing each week), so if it works for them $30 is a steal. Remember that out of the $30 John gets just $20 from Apple, and if you take another third out for other expenses you're looking at less than $14. Needless to say you need…

this paper-napkin math isn't entirely off-course... and my time as a developer would make much more fiscal sense if i went and did contract work... hell, i did this for a long time and made a ton of money in comparison to my "take" as an indie developer via the MAS. But, that wasn't the point and wasn't the motive... so, i am okay with "eating" those costs so that i might be more "in control" of this product's destin…

No problem John, I'm not (yet, at least) a user of your app I'm just a fellow indie that wanted to illustrate the reality of doing business at just $30/copy. Prices are low enough to make most indie development uneconomical in pure dollar terms. Though I wholeheartedly agree that money is not the only motivation, customers need to realise that developers need to make a decent living in order for there to be a vibrant ecosystem of apps.

As an indie who has made the mistake of both pricing too low and spending too much time on development (vs marketing) in the past, it looks like you've done very well to avoid these pitfalls so far!

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is great feedback and something I can do better. I had actually done a retrospective on the change of the landing page but you're right... it still needs improvement. At some point I'll probably hire a "real" designer to help me... since i'm not a designer by any stretch of the imagination.

I wouldn't even say it's a design issue. More of an information issue. If there's no demo available, I need (as a potential purchaser) quite a bit of information to know if it's worth risking my $$'s. I'd say some combination of screenshots/gifs or screencasts going through the program would be great. Or maybe more of a focus on the workflow, or maybe just expanding your features section to be illustrated with screen…

I'd argue that design and information are (or, should be) inextricably linked. Your advice is sound however!

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#85
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Believe me, I understand how hard it is. I've been working alone on a project for the past 2.5 years now (not quite ready for prime-time, but soon), so I know exactly what you mean. However, two things are just inexcusable to me: 1) this is a writing app /with no support for paragraph breaks/. That is unbelievable to me. Nobody who writes for a living can use an app that shows all of your text to you as a really larg…

If a programmer builds an amazingly perfect app, but has no users to see it, did she really build it? -Confucius In less snarky terms, I think focusing on marketing is super important. The faults and missing features can be fixed when you have users and money to pay for the work to do so. I'm sick of using a nice obscure app that is abandoned because I'm one of the few people who use it, so I'm less harsh on marketin…

one of the most important things that i've learned in the process of building this particular indie app is the fact that GAINING TRACTION should be as important as building the product.

that nearly killed me when i first realized that. this book really changed my perspective: http://blog.desk.pm/gaining-traction/

it's hard to do both... i mean, impossible... but i've focused more on doing a good job of building community, creating content, and gaining traction through experimentation (e.g. marketing on Gruber's blog) than I ever have...

and... it's kinda worked.!

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Believe me, I understand how hard it is. I've been working alone on a project for the past 2.5 years now (not quite ready for prime-time, but soon), so I know exactly what you mean. However, two things are just inexcusable to me: 1) this is a writing app /with no support for paragraph breaks/. That is unbelievable to me. Nobody who writes for a living can use an app that shows all of your text to you as a really larg…

> 1) this is a writing app /with no support for paragraph breaks/. That is unbelievable to me. Nobody who writes for a living can use an app that shows all of your text to you as a really large single block with no horizontal breaks between paragraphs. How? Why? Not only am I stupified by this, but I also am dumbfounded at all of these 5-star reviews that don't mention it or any of the other show-stoppper flaws I poi…

Yup. people are returning the product and there are a lot of people that hate the product... that's fine. i'm not trying to create a perfect product for 100% of the population... just certain people who will find it useful.

but, one of the biggest motivations for building this was knowing how hard it is to write, full stop. even after writing and blogging for 14 years... it's still as hard as ever.

any tool that can help me write and grab my strange amorphous thoughts and put them down into something understandable makes that ROI-value hit positive real quick.

so, for those people who are able to write more and publish more via the app... i think it's really worth it to them.

why? because writing is really fucking hard.

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#87
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this paper-napkin math isn't entirely off-course... and my time as a developer would make much more fiscal sense if i went and did contract work... hell, i did this for a long time and made a ton of money in comparison to my "take" as an indie developer via the MAS. But, that wasn't the point and wasn't the motive... so, i am okay with "eating" those costs so that i might be more "in control" of this product's destin…

No problem John, I'm not (yet, at least) a user of your app I'm just a fellow indie that wanted to illustrate the reality of doing business at just $30/copy. Prices are low enough to make most indie development uneconomical in pure dollar terms. Though I wholeheartedly agree that money is not the only motivation, customers need to realise that developers need to make a decent living in order for there to be a vibrant…

here here!

one of the biggest compliments and encouragements that i've received is that other indie developers have told me that i've done it "right" by pricing the app the way I've done it.

in fact, many of them have shared with me that they've done this wrong in the past and that they wanted to encourage me that i've gotten at least this part right!

the challenge is that those "atta boys!" are all private via DMs or individual emails... not public so they aren't available for all to see.

but to be sure, i've got a bunch and it feels great.

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a writer, I like the idea of a minimalist writing app. I really do. It feels natural. Just you and a blank screen so you can tap away and kill whatever demons are haunting you. Except there is a problem: serious writers need more than 'minimalism'. All the authors and novelists and long-form fiction writers I know have reams upon reams of notes, plot information, and character data cluttering up their MS Word (arg…

You do understand that Desk and Scrivener are not really in competition, right? Or do you also lecture Miata owners about how they're cute vehicles and all, but they should really know that Miatas are terrible for long-distance cargo hauling? (Edited...) I'm not particularly enamored of "minimalist" writing apps, either -- I'd really like to see a prose-focused editor with modern design sensibility with the editing c…

i second this... insofar as sharing that for years (a decade+) i've used basic markdown editors and even code editors for a lot of my writing.

many of them are not very good... but some of them are amazing. it's all about what works best for the individual.

:)

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#89

A previous amusing note from Gruber[1] on his sponsorship system and a sales email from Taboola, purveyor of the obnoxious click-bait grids that you're starting to see all over: > Speaking of revenue and pageviews, true story: I got an email yesterday from a sales rep at Taboola, pitching me on running their ads on DF. It included this line: “I see your site is not monetized at present, and I think there is room to d…

I try to boycott as many sites that use Taboola as possible... this can leave very few sites left to visit without hating myself... Them and Outbrain have to be the absolute worst that I see on "reputable" sites. You begin to truly understand a site's revenue integrity when you see these in their "Sponsored Content" sections.

This is why I personally don't like using an ad-blocker.

If I have ads blocked, then I'm blind to the problems that the average internet user faces. I end up viewing, reading, tweeting, talking about sites that are flat out reader-abusive in their advertising. As a web developer, my sense of the state of the internet is warped.

With ads turned on, I end up avoiding those sites and seeking quieter places. I have a better understanding of what normal people see.

Re: Does Sponsoring Daring Fireball Work?

#90
post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm given 100 "tokens" or "review copies" to give away for free per every single release via the MAS. Essentially, I ran out and couldn't give free copies for review for big name blogs and news sites and thus lost a lot of opportunities for free press.

Congratulations, first -- that's a good thing to run out of! But it's a bit infuriating that the problem seems to be completely fake; that is, of course Apple has no limitations to how many review copies and/or tokens they can generate; they could trivially give you a button to request more. In cases like yours, that would have been the more profitable choice for them... but they're operating at immense scale, which…

Well, it is a fake problem. There's nothing preventing a developer from hosting a binary on a server and sending the download link to a potential reviewer or user, other than the simple matter of implementing license checks and demo timeouts. It's the same now as it was 20 years ago.

It's telling that many App Store developers, even very successful ones, no longer bother with that crap. It's just so much easier for both the developer and user to send out a promo code in an email.

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