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Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

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Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#81

Post by beamso »

exDM69 wrote: post #39
encoderer wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't the article say they were working on this for 2 years?

Yes, the article did say that and I found it a bit odd. While they probably have been working on the power unit for two years, the split turbocharger was first seen at the first race. Of course, my knowledge is based on media reports, it is possible that none of the media have seen it in Jerez and Bahrain tests but it was first reported by Craig Scarborough during the Australian GP weekend.

The split turbocharger was most likely identified by interested journalists at the first race. The power train was homologated for the season at the end of February, so the design was finalised prior to the third pre-season test. It's most likely that the turbo was in this form a while ago.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#82

Post by usefulcat »

kalms wrote: post #46
WalterBright wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have an old muscle car with a built V8. The crackling sound of the engine start, and the sound it makes when it 'digs in' under acceleration, is viscerally thrilling. The smell of a hot engine, and the shaking of the car also add a lot of fun. One of the best movie montages ever is the opening sequence of the movie "Grand Prix" where they start the engines and warm em up. In "Rush" they ruined the movie by having a…

Sorry, but Bullitt's car chase is terribly boring. I don't get why it's so fascinating?

It's refreshing to see a car chase that looks and sounds a lot like what an actual car chase would actually look and sound like, as opposed to the very synthetic and stylized depictions typically found in modern movies and television.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#83

Post by grogers »

sbierwagen wrote: post #79
gahahaha wrote: post #22

Why would it be bad to put hot air into the engine? For blast furnaces you want to preheat the air going in so that it does not cool down the furnace. Is it just about cooling the engine down, or is it something else?

All three of the replies to your comment are true, but they don't cover everything. Car engines are heat engines, they extract mechanical work from differences in temperature. Heat engine efficiency is n = 1 - sqrt(Tcold/Thot) If Tcold, the cold end, isn't cold enough, then you lose efficiency, and thus horsepower. A badly overheating engine loses a lot of power. If you can cool the compressed air back down to ambien…

This seems orthogonal to me. Tcold for the efficiency is the exhaust temp, not the intake.

For pure efficiency, it is actually beneficial to capture waste heat in the exhaust to heat the intake air. But it destroys your power density, for the reasons already mentioned (hot air has less mass at the same pressure). I believe some automotive engines actually do this under light load conditions, but you wouldn't see it in F1.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#84

Post by ISL »

gregpilling wrote: post #74
enko wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to admit I love the sound of a good engine - and aeroplanes, and boats, trains, everything. It's the sound of power. Watching cars race without that sound is a far less emotive experience. One of the commentators on tonight's Bahrain race said that the safety car sounded much better than the race cars, and I wistfully agreed. That said, I do think some people overdo it a bit and I actually like that FIA is wil…

They have a long history of suppressing innovation though. Chapter 13 of this book is about all the tech that was banned. http://www.amazon.com/Formula-Technology-Peter-G-Wright/dp/0... It is the most interesting chapter in the book.

Search 'look inside' for the word 'banned' to see what greg's talking about. He's right. That's cool.

What would F1 be like if they relaxed all the rules?

Edit: Just got through the chapter, the author speculates on what would be possible without bans.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#85

Post by dwd »

dhughes wrote: post #52
jimmyrp wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of the hardcore fans seem to like the noise. I'm waiting for the teams to start pushing closer to the rev limit where the engines really start to scream (I think they use around 13000 of the 15000 available). CVT's were previously used but they were banned pretty quickly.

I've only been to one F1 race in person that was 1988 in Montreal and I couldn't believe the noise, vicious! My teeth vibrated, even my bones I couldn't believe I could feel my freaking skeletal bones vibrate. Some friends and I went because the turbos were going to be banned in 1989. I was 19 years old and the only thing I remember about the trip is 1) the noise! 2) crazy Italians 3) crazy Brazilians 4) strip club u…

The mid-80's turbo era was the best. The awesome sound, the cars twitching with the torque and sparks flying from the undertray made for good watching.

The JPS 98Ts are still possibly the best looking cars ever.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#86

Post by wmt »

ntkachov wrote: post #7

I'm loving the direction F1 is going. Sure, for the hardcore fans, the noise just isn't the same, and the cars aren't going as fast anymore, but I love that they are trying to force the manufacturers to improve their lower spec engines. Maybe the next rule change we'll have CVT as a requirement instead of a gear box.

"Sure, for the hardcore fans, the noise just isn't the same"

Many hardcore fans are more than happy that the cars sound again like they did back in the 80s before turbo was banned, a deep sound full of power.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#87

Post by emmelaich »

How much does anyone know about the details of this engine?

I'd like to think some of the immense amount of research and development that went into the Bishop Rotary Valve for Mercedes F1 has not gone to waste.

   http://home.people.net.au/~mrbdesign/PDF/AutoTechBRV.pdf
That innovation was killed by article 5.1.5 of FIA:

   "Only reciprocating poppet valves are permitted"
Seems a bit arbitrary. Though I have heard it the BRV was killed by the limit of certain metals seen as poisonous -- also dubious considering the danger is in the manufacture, not racing.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#88

Post by clef »

antr wrote: post #11
ntkachov wrote: post #7

I'm loving the direction F1 is going. Sure, for the hardcore fans, the noise just isn't the same, and the cars aren't going as fast anymore, but I love that they are trying to force the manufacturers to improve their lower spec engines. Maybe the next rule change we'll have CVT as a requirement instead of a gear box.

As an F1 fan, it isn't the noise, and speed that are making this championship "boring". It's the fact that Mercedes is so superior that you really have to ignore them in order to enjoy the "real" racing / fights behind them. (It's true that the Hamilton-Rosberg fight in Bahrain was also fun to watch) Mercedes' dominance is ridiculous - and I don't want to take engineering credits away, but there are no fights to watc…

Just as ridiculous ( and remarkable) as Ferrari's dominance was for so many years with ol' Schumi at the wheel. As long as no one is cheating, whoever leads most certainly deserve to be at the top.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#89

Post by megablast »

sbierwagen wrote: post #12
johnwyles wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also keep in mind that Formula E debuts this year; it will be the sport we all eventually follow (not sure how I feel about the passing cars sounding more like aircraft than cars): http://www.fiaformulae.com/

Who cares about the sound? I'm tired of seeing blog comments on Jalopnik complaining about it. Of the many dumb excuses car nuts use to whine about electric cars, "they sound different!" is by far the worst.

As someone who had to study and do exams while the F1 was one, thank you and screw those people.

Re: Mercedes Is Owning This Formula 1 Season

#90

Post by gaadd33 »

ISL wrote: post #84
gregpilling wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have a long history of suppressing innovation though. Chapter 13 of this book is about all the tech that was banned. http://www.amazon.com/Formula-Technology-Peter-G-Wright/dp/0... It is the most interesting chapter in the book.

Search 'look inside' for the word 'banned' to see what greg's talking about. He's right. That's cool. What would F1 be like if they relaxed all the rules? Edit: Just got through the chapter, the author speculates on what would be possible without bans.

I haven't read the book but I think CanAm in the 70s was pretty much racing with no engineering restrictions. Hence you had the Porsche 917 putting out 1500hp+ and only weighing 1800 lbs.
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