Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

iOS7 is not about flat

medium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 135 posts

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#81

Post by DannyBee »

glhaynes wrote: post #36
untog wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But we've been told for years that Android is fundamentally broken because it allows this. I guess everyone changed their mind?

As has been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, it's not exactly the same: iOS is still much more strict about what runs and when. Apps get woken up only when the system decides to wake them up, and it decides based on current battery life/power state, other system activity level, and the user's usage patterns of the app. Then, once woken up, apps get a limited time to run.

Android does this as well, so I guess like the guy you are responding to, i don't see a real difference.

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#82

Post by DannyBee »

techtalsky wrote: post #2

Sounds like another way for apps to drain my precious battery life.

Don't worry, HN is about to tell you how apple has magically solved this problem in exactly the same way android did, but how it's different because apple did it!

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#83

Post by guelo »

bobz wrote: post #64
013 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like something Apple would want to patent. I wouldn't be surprised if we saw some new Apple Vs. Android, Apple Vs. Mozilla lawsuit about "background fetching".

Android has had "Sync Adapters" since the beginning, a very cool and powerful framework that allows apps to piggy back off each other's data connections, reducing the number of times the cell modem needs to be fired up for background fetches. Not a new concept, I'm sure the patent battle lines are already well drawn.

SyncAdapters were added in Android 2.x

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#84

Post by nsxwolf »

freehunter wrote: post #77
nsxwolf wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A 7.9 inch tablet, which is much larger than a 7 inch tablet.

The two standard product classifications is "7 inch tablet" and "10 inch tablet". Those are standardized names, even though there is really no 10" tablet and really no 7" tablet. The iPad is grouped in with 10" tablet even though the screen size is slightly less than 10". Similar to how the iPhone 5 has a 4" screen, but it's much smaller than a normal 4" screen in width. That's the product category. "7 inch tablet" a…

I sound ridiculous because people miscategorized the iPad mini into the same category as the Nexus 7?

Have you used both? Two very different experiences.

So I'm saying the two categories are insufficient. The iPad mini is a compact iPad. It's a third category. 7" tablets are more like large smartphones.

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#85

Post by glhaynes »

DannyBee wrote: post #81
glhaynes wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As has been pointed out elsewhere in this thread, it's not exactly the same: iOS is still much more strict about what runs and when. Apps get woken up only when the system decides to wake them up, and it decides based on current battery life/power state, other system activity level, and the user's usage patterns of the app. Then, once woken up, apps get a limited time to run.

Android does this as well, so I guess like the guy you are responding to, i don't see a real difference.

To my understanding, Android offers something similar and also allows apps to wake up arbitrarily in the background. Reasonable people can disagree on whether the latter ought to be an option or not (or, perhaps even more reasonably, can be happy that both types of devices exist so people can choose which they'd prefer). But the complaint regarding Android was that it let poorly-behaved apps drain significant amounts of battery in the background and it's not true that Apple has now added that possibility.

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#86

Post by forgottenpass »

nsxwolf wrote: post #84
freehunter wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The two standard product classifications is "7 inch tablet" and "10 inch tablet". Those are standardized names, even though there is really no 10" tablet and really no 7" tablet. The iPad is grouped in with 10" tablet even though the screen size is slightly less than 10". Similar to how the iPhone 5 has a 4" screen, but it's much smaller than a normal 4" screen in width. That's the product category. "7 inch tablet" a…

I sound ridiculous because people miscategorized the iPad mini into the same category as the Nexus 7? Have you used both? Two very different experiences. So I'm saying the two categories are insufficient. The iPad mini is a compact iPad. It's a third category. 7" tablets are more like large smartphones.

>Two very different experiences.

Well its a good thing the parent is saying they're just two items in a category. Not two exact same things.

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#87

Post by DannyBee »

glhaynes wrote: post #85
DannyBee wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Android does this as well, so I guess like the guy you are responding to, i don't see a real difference.

To my understanding, Android offers something similar and also allows apps to wake up arbitrarily in the background. Reasonable people can disagree on whether the latter ought to be an option or not (or, perhaps even more reasonably, can be happy that both types of devices exist so people can choose which they'd prefer). But the complaint regarding Android was that it let poorly-behaved apps drain significant amounts…

So you know all the technical implementation details of both?

Or are you comparing random API doc material and actual technical details?

Apple says a lot of things, not all of them turn out to be technically accurate.

For example, do you know it actually will not allow poorly behaved apps to drain battery, or is this just an assumption based on what apple says will happen?

What always happens in these discussions is people say "apple's docs say x, so it must be like x". Quite often, when people actually go and look at how it operates, it isn't like x at all.

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#88

Post by bztzt »

roin wrote: post #71
jliptzin wrote: post #12

IMO iOS 7 is a textbook case of fixing something that's not broken.

I remember when someone writing for TechCrunch published a takedown of the iOS 4 beta for ruining the iPhone experience with distracting features such as folders and wallpaper. The unlikely day that Apple takes the approach that "you don't fix what ain't broke" would be a sad sad day indeed.

I would still question the value of folders. It makes the homescreen customization experience more confusing and frustrating for everyone in exchange for functionality that's only really useful for a small % of enthusiasts.

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#89

Post by glhaynes »

DannyBee wrote: post #87
glhaynes wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To my understanding, Android offers something similar and also allows apps to wake up arbitrarily in the background. Reasonable people can disagree on whether the latter ought to be an option or not (or, perhaps even more reasonably, can be happy that both types of devices exist so people can choose which they'd prefer). But the complaint regarding Android was that it let poorly-behaved apps drain significant amounts…

So you know all the technical implementation details of both? Or are you comparing random API doc material and actual technical details? Apple says a lot of things, not all of them turn out to be technically accurate. For example, do you know it actually will not allow poorly behaved apps to drain battery, or is this just an assumption based on what apple says will happen? What always happens in these discussions is…

The discussion was around architecture. Of course it may not behave as intended when actually implemented because of bugs. Or because of Apple outright lying in their communications. Sure, those are possibilities, but they're irrelevant to architectural criticism.

Re: iOS7 is not about flat

#90

Post by MichaelGG »

potatolicious wrote: post #29
MichaelGG wrote: post #20

Forgive my complete ignorance on the topic: Can't you just push down the information the customer needs? I get that it might be more difficult to use the push API but could an app theoretically have achieved the same experience via push? Also, I'm not quite sure API enhancements are what a release is "about". Admitting that the crazy 3D designs were over the top and adopting a design similar to Metro and Android Holo…

Sort of. Yes and no. You can bundle whatever data you want on a push notification, but there are some restrictions: - Size limits. It's a push notification, so the amount of payload you can attach is pretty limited. Not the whole conversation history of a chat, for example. - Lack of guarantees or SLA means using it this for time-ordered information is a bad idea. For example, assembling a chat history from a series…

Thanks for the excellent details. I thought that email also used push (on all platforms). Is that special cased? Or a different type of push?
Post reply on HN