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Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

articles.sun-sentinel.com

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Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#81

Post by sfall »

ok I really am not getting this it says:

"the technical challenges were daunting because the raw information does not allow speed calculations,'' Maines said. "We came up with some neat tricks to overcome that, and it's great that the judges recognized our hard work.""

I am crazy to think that the raw data would be something like: account#, toll location, time And this would be the bare minimum. How would determining the length between tolls and using the times to determine the average speed required be "neat tricks"? Am I really off?

I am not saying it wasn't hard work, but please tell me the real technical challenges, that I really would love to hear.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#82

Post by [deleted] »

civilian wrote: post #70
vacri wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apples and oranges. The number in the article is 'crashes caused by officers driving at high speed ', the general pop statistic is all vehicular deaths. Similarly, deaths per 100k is the rate of victimisation amongst the population. Deaths per number of officers is a rate of offending, not victimisation.

Right. There are a lot of improvements to be made, but I'm just trying to make a quick estimate to compare to.

[deleted]

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#83

Post by lesterbuck »

nonce42 wrote: post #75
samolang wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Regarding a (at least in the US) I think a big part of the problem is a system of laws that people generally agree is unjust (i.e. the drug laws)

I find it strange that the US has laws that many people break and the law is only enforced sporadically. Some examples in California are speeding, missing front license plate, age of consent laws, use tax on out-of-state/internet purchases, and illegal immigration. Having a bunch of laws that people break with impunity has a "broken window" effect, leading to less respect for the law overall. (Whether or not these la…

There is absolutely nothing new in tech advances that makes it easier to enforce speeding laws. In the 80s I read some book about beating speeding tickets, and they did the math about the profit margin on a radar gun. It turned out that the average radar gun generated a net profit on the order of $1000/day/gun. The obvious question is why aren't there radar guns on every police car? The answer is obvious: local politicians don't like to get tickets, either.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#84

Post by glesica »

corwinstephen wrote: post #26
jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

Frustrating? Yes. Shocking? No. Did anyone really believe that taking a job as a police officer somehow suppressed these people's natural desire to drive fast? Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place. Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doin…

> Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place.

This. If we believe that people will tend to behave in accordance with their incentives (and we all do, because we're all good capitalists here) then this is a virtual certainty.

Cops get paid X per year. So, all things being equal, some number of people who think it is worthwhile to do the job for X per year will sign up. A few will take the job because they want to help people, so they are willing to work for less than they would at some other job. At the same time, and in the same vein, a few will take the job because it allows them "perks" like hurting people and generally breaking the law without consequence. This is why it is so, so important to hold police to a higher standard, because in the long run we want more of the "want to help people" type and fewer of the "want to break the law" type.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#85

Post by CamperBob2 »

joseph_cooney wrote: post #58
corwinstephen wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Frustrating? Yes. Shocking? No. Did anyone really believe that taking a job as a police officer somehow suppressed these people's natural desire to drive fast? Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place. Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doin…

I would have thought dealing with the consequences of speeding in their jobs (notifying families of the death of loved ones, seeing the terrible injuries caused) would have stopped them. I know a few people who work in that area and that stuff stays with them. For example - they've assured me I should never buy a motor bike.

(Shrug) There aren't any "consequences of speeding." If you hit something or kill somebody, you were doing something wrong besides speeding.

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#86

Post by [deleted] »

joseph_cooney wrote: post #58
corwinstephen wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Frustrating? Yes. Shocking? No. Did anyone really believe that taking a job as a police officer somehow suppressed these people's natural desire to drive fast? Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place. Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doin…

I would have thought dealing with the consequences of speeding in their jobs (notifying families of the death of loved ones, seeing the terrible injuries caused) would have stopped them. I know a few people who work in that area and that stuff stays with them. For example - they've assured me I should never buy a motor bike.

[deleted]

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#87

Post by ajtaylor »

corwinstephen wrote: post #26
jere wrote: post #10

>The reporters found nearly 800 officers who reached speeds of 90-130 mph, many of them while off duty. The accidents caused by officers driving at high speeds had caused at least 320 crashes since 2004, killing or maiming 21 people. That's such a horrifying statistic if true. Even at their peak, homicide offending rates in the US were at around 20 per 100,000; assault rates about 10 times as high: http://bjs.gov/con…

Frustrating? Yes. Shocking? No. Did anyone really believe that taking a job as a police officer somehow suppressed these people's natural desire to drive fast? Hell, that's probably what make them join the force in the first place. Sure, it's irresponsible and illegal for off-duty officers to speed, but it's also irresponsible and illegal for regular citizens to speed, and yet that doesn't seem to stop them from doin…

> Do you hold them to a higher level of moral responsibility during their off time because of what they do for a living?

In a word, yes! I expect a judge to engage in ethical behaviour when not behind the bench, a politician to tell the truth (as laughable as that is) and so on. Sure, cops are human but they should also know that by virtue of their position they are much more visible than the ordinary citizen and act accordingly. Surely you can see the hypocrisy of a cop giving tickets for speeding when they get away with the very same behaviour. Maybe I'm old fashioned, I think cops should not be able to say "Do as I say, not as I do."

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#88

Post by ajtaylor »

dnm wrote: post #54
wahsd wrote: post #40

"The database was so innovative that two law enforcement agencies sent investigators to the newsroom to learn how to replicate it." Expect your ticket in the mail, while legislation is passed that prevents cops from being held accountable.

I'm curious as to the technical details. I can't imagine why investigators couldn't get access to the raw Sun Pass database, which records tag id, toll booth, and a timestamp, if it works anything like my EZ-Pass system. From that, it's trivial to match up enter/exit records and divide the distance by the time to come up with an average speed. The article says they got the data from 12 police departments. I wonder wh…

I wondered the same thing. Perhaps the distance between toll booths is what they measured in the 2500 miles driven? It seems like you should be able to get the data from OSM as well, with a lot less time required!

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#89

Post by ritchiea »

ajmurmann wrote: post #45

Nothing makes me more upset than corrupt cops. Obviously the off-duty cops got away with speeding because cops don't give tickets to other cops. That's the real scandal. Corrupt cops undermine the entire legal system, which is much worse than anything any terrorist could ever hope to achieve. They should be treated accordingly!

You must be upset a lot

Re: Data journalism busts speeding cops, wins Pulitzer

#90

Post by eru »

lesterbuck wrote: post #83
nonce42 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it strange that the US has laws that many people break and the law is only enforced sporadically. Some examples in California are speeding, missing front license plate, age of consent laws, use tax on out-of-state/internet purchases, and illegal immigration. Having a bunch of laws that people break with impunity has a "broken window" effect, leading to less respect for the law overall. (Whether or not these la…

There is absolutely nothing new in tech advances that makes it easier to enforce speeding laws. In the 80s I read some book about beating speeding tickets, and they did the math about the profit margin on a radar gun. It turned out that the average radar gun generated a net profit on the order of $1000/day/gun. The obvious question is why aren't there radar guns on every police car? The answer is obvious: local polit…

> It turned out that the average radar gun generated a net profit on the order of $1000/day/gun. The obvious question is why aren't there radar guns on every police car?

I agree with your sentiment. But please bear in mind, that the profit per radar gun would probably go down, if enforcement was less sporadic.

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