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Prosecutor as bully

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Re: Prosecutor as bully

#81

Post by javajosh »

I am ashamed. I am ashamed that I didn't do more to help aaron when he was alive. I am ashamed that I didn't reach out to him, donate money, donate time. I am ashamed that I've allowed this to go on, to go on in my name as an American.

I've always hated bullies, even as a kid. In elementary school I would come to the aid of those being abused. And over the years, I still get angry, but I so rarely do anything anymore. It's too big, too complex, too scary.

No more. It is time to shine light into the dark corridors of American power, to get personally involved. The only way for the abuse of power to continue is for us to ignore it.

Re: Prosecutor as bully

#82

Post by jfager »

pbateman wrote: post #2

From the link in the article: Depending on how many of the counts Swartz is found guilty of, the sentence could conceivably total 50+ years and fine in the area of $4 million. What an absurd and unreasonable level of punishment. Carmen Ortiz, the prosecutor who was behind this[1] needs to be publicly shamed. [1] (source: http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/07/19/reddit-co-founder-c... )

The prosecutors actually working the case were Scott L. Garland and Stephen P. Heymann. (source: http://ia600504.us.archive.org/29/items/gov.uscourts.mad.137...)

Re: Prosecutor as bully

#83

Post by raverbashing »

andrewtbham wrote: post #49
jdminhbg wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with your edit. There's definitely a systemic problem, but it's a systemic problem with elected officials. Naming, shaming, and voting them out is the solution.

I agree naming and shaming is a good idea. It puts a name and a face to the story... not just some nebulous "the system is broken." People need a narrative to humanize the situation and it can serve as a warning to other prosecutors.

This

The system is supported by people. Someone is responsible.

Not naming the people responsible is only good for them and is probably what they want.

Re: Prosecutor as bully

#84

Post by rokhayakebe »

dmix wrote: post #54
temphn wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Naming and shaming Carmen M. Ortiz for destroying the life of a young man is exactly what is necessary. She brought 13 felony counts against him for downloading articles that should be freely available, after JSTOR itself had dropped the charges. Destroying her career and seeing her fired in disgrace will send a message to all other overzealous prosecutors, in the same way that she surely thought her prosecution of S…

How do we go about getting this message across to her and other key people (legally)? I'm interested in helping.

I have a feeling Anonymous will get on this case. Sadly enough this is not one of those cases where a few messages is going to "send the message."

Re: Prosecutor as bully

#85

Post by vermontdevil »

We need to stop glorifying the prosector by rewarding them with political victories. I don't believe being a good DA equals being a good governor or senator. These two roles are mutually exclusive.

But I fear our citizenry is just too lazy to really understand all the different candidates and vote for the best one for the job. Instead they depend on abstract figures such as conviction rates, aggressive attitudes on crime, etc to determine who gets their vote.

Can be frustrating at times.

Additionally I just read that the prosector in Aaron's case, Carmen Ortiz, is being considered as a candidate for Governor of Massachusetts. It might be something for the hacker community in that state to organize and utilize the web (social media, etc) to make sure she does not go that far.

Re: Prosecutor as bully

#87

Post by [deleted] »

MaysonL wrote: post #67
temphn wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Naming and shaming Carmen M. Ortiz for destroying the life of a young man is exactly what is necessary. She brought 13 felony counts against him for downloading articles that should be freely available, after JSTOR itself had dropped the charges. Destroying her career and seeing her fired in disgrace will send a message to all other overzealous prosecutors, in the same way that she surely thought her prosecution of S…

The trouble is, if Obama hasn't shut down Guantanomo, let Bradley Manning be held in conditions amounting to torture, et bloody cetera, what in hell makes you think he's going to fire and shame one of his best US Attorneys over a tragic death that she contributed to? It's probably more likely (though not very) that she will resign of her own volition.

[deleted]

Re: Prosecutor as bully

#88

Post by RexRollman »

andrewtbham wrote: post #68
dmix wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do we go about getting this message across to her and other key people (legally)? I'm interested in helping.

I think we need to start lobbying for a bill that decriminalizes copyright infringement and makes it purely a civil matter.

But the people who want that don't contribute millions of dollars of campaign donations.

Re: Prosecutor as bully

#90

Post by kirillzubovsky »

agwa wrote: post #18

From the article: For in the 18 months of negotiations, that was what he was not willing to accept, and so that was the reason he was facing a million dollar trial in April — his wealth bled dry, yet unable to appeal openly to us for the financial help he needed to fund his defense, at least without risking the ire of a district court judge. Remember, this was on HN just a week ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?…

Perhaps it is the system's fault because it is not set to find the truth, but rather as a sports event between the defender and the prosecutor. Each one does their job and at the end, the winner takes all, whether for right or for wrong.

I have a friend who is a prosecutor and I had heard him talk about his work before. Everything he said was focused on winning. He was proud that he was able to dig out cases from the past where people went free, and then send them to jail. He was proud how good he was at prosecuting people. For all I know, he kept a score.

Is being so driven by the end goal a good thing? Sure it is, when you are prosecuting an actual bad guy. But, as it was my impression from my friend, it didn't really matter to him how bad the guy; all that matters is whether he can win. In that case, the system is at fault for allowing this kind of competition with human lives, but the individuals are at fault for playing the game.

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