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Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

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Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#81

Post by Findecanor »

reactordev wrote: post #33
smoe wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is kind of funny that throughout my career, there has always been pretty much a consensus that lines of code are a bad metric, but now with all the AI hype, suddenly everybody is again like “Look at all the lines of code it writes!!” I use LLMs all day every day, but measuring someone or something by the number of lines of code produced is still incredibly stupid, in my opinion.

Microsoft never got that memo. They still measure LoC because it’s all MBAs.

If so, it hasn't always been that way. Steve Ballmer on IBM and KLoC's: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHI7RTKhlz0

(I think it is from "Triumph of the Nerds" (1996), but I can't find the time code)

Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#83

Post by bluGill »

walt_grata wrote: post #68
reactordev wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft never got that memo. They still measure LoC because it’s all MBAs.

Fuck is there a way to have that degree and not be clueless and toxic to your colleagues and users.

It all comes from "if you can't measure it you can't improve it". The job of management is to improve things, and that means they need to measure it and in turn look for measures. When working on an assembly line there are lots of things to measure and improve, and improving many of those things have shown great value.

They want to expand that value into engineering and so are looking for something they can measure. I haven't seen anyone answer what can be measured to make a useful improvement though. I have a good "feeling" that some people I work with are better than others, but most are not so bad that we should fire them - but I don't know how to put that into something objective.

Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#84

Post by austinthetaco »

smoe wrote: post #26
onion2k wrote: post #6

Microsoft have a goal that states they want to get to " 1 engineer, 1 month, 1 million lines of code. " You can't do that if you write the code yourself. That means they'll always be chasing the best model. Right now, that's Opus 4.5.

It is kind of funny that throughout my career, there has always been pretty much a consensus that lines of code are a bad metric, but now with all the AI hype, suddenly everybody is again like “Look at all the lines of code it writes!!” I use LLMs all day every day, but measuring someone or something by the number of lines of code produced is still incredibly stupid, in my opinion.

I believe the "look at all the lines of code" argument for LLMs is not a way to showcase intelligence, but more-so a way to showcase time saved. Under the guise that the output is the/a correct solution, it's a way to say "look at all the code I would have had to write, it saved so much time".

Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#85

Post by cush »

dataviz1000 wrote: post #10

I installed Claude Code yesterday after the quality of VSCode Copilot Chat continuously is getting worse every release. I can't tell yet if Claude Code is better or not but VSCode Copilot Chat has become completely unusable. It would start making mistakes which would double the requests to Claude Opus 4.5 which in January is the only model that would work at all. I spent $400 in tokens in January. I'll know better in…

What were you spending on Copilot?

Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#86

Post by philipwhiuk »

funkyfiddler369 wrote: post #80
richsouth wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because as we all know, lines of code == quality of code.

I mean, if 1% out of 8 billion is "top" and that applies to Lines of Code, too, than ... more code contains more quality, ... by their logic, I guess ...

What if the % declines proportionally (or worse) to the growth in code.

Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#87

Post by cush »

k__ wrote: post #27
fastThinking wrote: post #9

So Copilot is for customers, Claude is for getting actual work done?

Copilot isn't a model, you can use Claude via Copilot.

I don’t think that’s what they were insinuating. Claude Code internally, Copilot for customers.

Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#89

Post by giancarlostoro »

mcintyre1994 wrote: post #38
hpdigidrifter wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't speak for copilot but Gemini cli is unbelievably bad compared to Gemini web. CC has some magic secret sauce and I'm not sure what it is. My company pays for both too, I keep coming back to Claude all-round

Claude Code is one of a very few AI tools where I genuinely think the people at the company who build it use it all the time.

They absolutely do, the CEO has come out and said a few engineers have told him that they dont even write code by hand anymore. To some people that sounds horrifying, but a good engineer would not just take code blindly, they would read it and refine it using Claude, while still saving hundreds of man hours.

Re: Claude Code is suddenly everywhere inside Microsoft

#90

Post by khkjhkjiug »

GaProgMan wrote: post #64
kcb wrote: post #46

And probably running on their macbooks...

True story: a lot of the Microsoft engineers I interact with actually do use Apple hardware. Admittedly, I onto interact with the devs on the .NET (and related technologies) departments. Specifically WHY they use Apple hardware is something I can only speculate on. Presumably it's easier to launch Windows on Mac than the other way around, and they would likely need to do that as .NET and its related technologies are…

100% true story - until a couple of months ago, the best place to talk directly to Microsoft senior devs was on the macadmins slack. Loads of them there. They would regularly post updates, talk to people about issues, discuss solutions, even happy to engage in DMS. All posting using their real names.

The accounts have now all gone quiet, guess they got told to quit it.

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