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If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

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Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#81

Post by horsawlarway »

bhouston wrote: post #76
zdp7 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't need an expensive switch. Five port 2.5G + SFP+ with poe can be pretty affordable and shouldn't run very hot.

That downgrades transfer speeds though to just 2.5G.

Which is fine? It's getting capped to 3 at your modem anyways... And the difference here is reaching the "doesn't matter" phase.

Like - 50GB at 3gbps is ~130 seconds, ~160 seconds at 2.5gbps, and ~400 seconds at 1gbps

You're always waiting at least a couple minutes, and never more than 10 for that download.

Personally - I have a couple 10gbps switches that run my backbone in my house (NAS, k8s cluster, HomeAssistant, etc) and I have a 2gbps symmetric wan, but all of the offices (my wife and I both work from home, plus the media room, plus the kid's playroom) all just run 1gbps switches.

They're cheap, normal office work basically never saturates those speeds (even multiple conference calls with video is a-ok), and there's just not enough value in bumping up to 10gbps across the whole house compared to the equipment cost.

The 10gbps switches live in the basement and just connect those zones.

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#82

Post by SAI_Peregrinus »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #58
fach wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would running fiber make Ethernet obsolete? Physical medium and framing on the wire are fairly orthogonal.

People commonly use the word "Ethernet" to mean "Ethernet cable", as in a copper cable with an RJ45 on it, not just "Ethernet protocol", which is used over both copper and fiber alike.

It's interesting how long twisted-pair cabling has stuck around, to the point that it's associated as being the physical medium for Ethernet. Ethernet started with coaxial cables, but soon lost its association with those as twisted-pair was cheaper & easier to work with. And it's stayed that way for so long that a CAT-5 cable with RJ-45 (really RJ-38 but that's excessively pedantic) connectors is an "Ethernet cable", and a perfectly usable fiber optic cable is something else!

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#84

Post by hinkley »

jagged-chisel wrote: post #80
hinkley wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Though if it is on or under the surface of the earth, “straight” will be a bend radius of around 6,370km. We don’t make a lot of buildings that deal with this but transcontinental or transoceanic cables certainly do. If someone designed a fiber that required absolutely no bend in order to work you’d have to use it in buildings or dig much deeper holes. There was an encoding mechanism proposed about 10-15 years ago th…

If you’re using the planet as your “flat surface” then sure. If, however, you’re willing to deal with exiting the atmosphere at each end, you can use Real Straightness. But I don’t know anyone running a single segment for that distance.

I’m sure there are some microwave antennas still out there doing the Lord’s Work. At least in the Plains states where hills are low and putting antennas on two of them gives you some extra distance. How far do microwaves bend over the horizon?

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#85

Post by cruffle_duffle »

hobs wrote: post #56
bhouston wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can also get baseboards (that look nice in a home) then double as cable runs. Interesting. That would be great in the basement. I will look into it.

Dont forget Powerline adapters - if you have it all on one loop they are surprisingly effective if you have extra power sockets!

If you go that route MOCA over your cable tv coax works very well too!

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#86

Post by bhouston »

horsawlarway wrote: post #81
bhouston wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That downgrades transfer speeds though to just 2.5G.

Which is fine? It's getting capped to 3 at your modem anyways... And the difference here is reaching the "doesn't matter" phase. Like - 50GB at 3gbps is ~130 seconds, ~160 seconds at 2.5gbps, and ~400 seconds at 1gbps You're always waiting at least a couple minutes, and never more than 10 for that download. Personally - I have a couple 10gbps switches that run my backbone in my house (NAS, k8s cluster, HomeAssistant,…

You are completely right that I can always just wait. I prefer not to though... there are a lot of times when it is amazing to have 10G between my main machines.

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#87

Post by mmastrac »

graton wrote: post #71
Epa095 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why DAC cables over Cat6a or Cat7

They are the lowest power way to connect SFP. And they are cheap. Though I'm not sure I would pull them as they tend to max out at around 6-7 meters. I use them to connect systems within the same rack/room.

Floor to floor in a house isn't too bad with 6-7m, but I suppose there's always the AOC cables that are 20m+.

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#88

Post by avidiax »

stronglikedan wrote: post #55
timzaman wrote: post #8

1. High-level, the post is all wrong. The point should be that you always need to make sure you can pull new cable . The poster illustrates this: single mode, multi mode, non-fiber, etc, etc. And if one "goes bad", you still can't run a new one, unless you have a pullstring. 2. The post cannot apply to fast/large networks - will be prohibitively expensive. 3. If running a few at home, I suggest to run MTP/MPO. It's b…

> And if one "goes bad", you still can't run a new one, unless you have a pullstring. The one that went bad is the pullstring.

> The one that went bad is the pullstring.

That works for short runs, but for long runs, the only way to pull the cable without breaking it is to use wire pulling lubricant.

And there's no guarantee that the cable you are pulling is undamaged. Rats don't improve pull strength, and even an electrically good cable can have the tensile strength cord severed.

If you are in that situation, pulling the old cable with dried lube on it may snap it in two, especially if it's pulling the new strand.

That's why leaving a pulling tape in each conduit is a good idea.

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#89

Post by c0nsumer »

bityard wrote: post #45
jmacd wrote: post #15

I just had this experience. I had a 200ft run between my house and barn. The original builder put a direct bury ethernet between the two and it failed. I dug a trench, put in a conduit, pulled 2 fibre lines and left a pull string in. I recently had the primary fibre fail and am now on the backup. If I need to pull new ones in the future I can do that pretty easily through the conduit.

Yep. Direct-burial ethernet is surprisingly vulnerable to nearby lightning strikes. It's not a matter of IF the cable or devices get damaged, it's a matter of when. Nearby (not even direct) lightning induces ground voltage potentials between buildings to the tune of hundreds of volts or more.

Do you have experience or information on direct burial ethernet for something like a POE camera? I'd like to put one on the back fence to watch the back of the house and yard. Direct burial in the back yard would be a plenty easy thing to do, but the cable is pricey enough that I've held off for now.

Re: If you get the chance, always run more extra network fiber cabling

#90

Post by recursive »

SAI_Peregrinus wrote: post #82
JoshTriplett wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People commonly use the word "Ethernet" to mean "Ethernet cable", as in a copper cable with an RJ45 on it, not just "Ethernet protocol", which is used over both copper and fiber alike.

It's interesting how long twisted-pair cabling has stuck around, to the point that it's associated as being the physical medium for Ethernet. Ethernet started with coaxial cables, but soon lost its association with those as twisted-pair was cheaper & easier to work with. And it's stayed that way for so long that a CAT-5 cable with RJ-45 (really RJ-38 but that's excessively pedantic) connectors is an "Ethernet cable",…

I've been in software for decades, and it was only right now that I realized that what I'm calling "ethernet cable" is maybe something else. Not that I understand the finer details of what you're saying.
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